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Is your iMac or Macbook getting long in the tooth ?

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Is your iMac or Macbook getting long in the tooth ?

Postby RogerS » 24 Sep 2020, 12:47

As in, say, 2007 ? Do you use iPhoto ? Thinking about getting a new iMac? Now or in the future ? If so then read on.

Here's a heads-up.

Over the years, iPhoto has had numerous upgrades as has the replacement Photos. The underlying file structures have also changed. And, of course, OSX has had a lot of releases. Basically the issue is the further apart your current version of iPhoto and OSX is and the current version of Photos of OSX, the harder you will find it to migrate your photos.

LOML's Mac is 2007. iPhoto '08. (version 7.1.5) and OSX 10.9.5. Just got her a new Mac. Photos 5.0 and OSX 10.15.6. Bottom line - you can't migrate from one to the other in one go. You need another Mac that's got the right software somewhere between the two. Old enough that you can get the 2007 into a suitable format that is readable and can be migrated over by the most recent Mac.
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Re: Is your iMac or Macbook getting long in the tooth ?

Postby TrimTheKing » 24 Sep 2020, 12:49

a pain but easily enough done by dual booting the new Mac I would think.
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Re: Is your iMac or Macbook getting long in the tooth ?

Postby RogerS » 24 Sep 2020, 12:56

TrimTheKing wrote:a pain but easily enough done by dual booting the new Mac I would think.


I don't think so but happy to be proved wrong. What would dual-booting achieve (assuming that (a) the new iMac will actually run 10.9.5 and more importantly (b) I can actually get a copy of 10.9.5).
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Re: Is your iMac or Macbook getting long in the tooth ?

Postby TrimTheKing » 24 Sep 2020, 13:19

1. Dual boot new Mac at a version compatible with the old version of iPhoto/photos, but as high as you can go.
2. Copy the old photo library externally then import into old version on dual boot.
3. Do the needful to bring it up to speed with that version (import into iPhoto/Photos).
4. Export photo library externally again, scrap dual boot old version, re-dual boot with another version that can take the library and upgrade.
4. Rinse and repeat until the library is at the version you need to import into new OS on new Mac.

Might take you 2-4 installs but it's eminently doable and I have done it before on my iMac.

And you don't need 10.9.5, you need the latest version that will accept the photo library from 10.9.5, AND will run on the new Mac. That information will be well within your Google powers to locate.
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Re: Is your iMac or Macbook getting long in the tooth ?

Postby Andyp » 24 Sep 2020, 13:55

Most of that has gone over my head. But as my iMac is 11 years old now I have been following Roger's recent travails with interest

My late 2009 el capitan (10.11.6) is at least running photos 1.5 so I will have to assume that when the time comes upgrading from old photos to new photos would be less of a problem. Or am I being naive?
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Re: Is your iMac or Macbook getting long in the tooth ?

Postby RogerS » 24 Sep 2020, 14:08

TrimTheKing wrote:1. Dual boot new Mac at a version compatible with the old version of iPhoto/photos, but as high as you can go.
2. Copy the old photo library externally then import into old version on dual boot.
3. Do the needful to bring it up to speed with that version (import into iPhoto/Photos).
4. Export photo library externally again, scrap dual boot old version, re-dual boot with another version that can take the library and upgrade.
4. Rinse and repeat until the library is at the version you need to import into new OS on new Mac.

Might take you 2-4 installs but it's eminently doable and I have done it before on my iMac.

And you don't need 10.9.5, you need the latest version that will accept the photo library from 10.9.5, AND will run on the new Mac. That information will be well within your Google powers to locate.



Blimey...what a faff ! Much much easier to use the intermediate Mac IMO. Not sure that all those older versions of OSX are that easy to get hold of.
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Re: Is your iMac or Macbook getting long in the tooth ?

Postby RogerS » 24 Sep 2020, 14:09

Andyp wrote:Most of that has gone over my head. But as my iMac is 11 years old now I have been following Roger's recent travails with interest

My late 2009 el capitan (10.11.6) is at least running photos 1.5 so I will have to assume that when the time comes upgrading from old photos to new photos would be less of a problem. Or am I being naive?


You should be good to go, Andy, as my intermediate Mac is also El C and Photos 1.5.
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Re: Is your iMac or Macbook getting long in the tooth ?

Postby TrimTheKing » 24 Sep 2020, 14:12

I thought you couldn't use the old one because it couldn't take the newer version, which is why I suggested that.

If you can do point upgrades on the old until you've taken it as far as possible then obviously that is the way to go. All I would say is that I was glad for backup when I tried to take mine from Lion to Yosemite because it was a fully allowed upgrade but it killed my Mac dead. I had to completely wipe it and start afresh on Lion because my Time Machine backups from Lion wouldn't work AT ALL in Yosemite.

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Re: Is your iMac or Macbook getting long in the tooth ?

Postby Woodbloke » 24 Sep 2020, 16:09

Andyp wrote:Most of that has gone over my head. But as my iMac is 11 years old now I have been following Roger's recent travails with interest


As is my iMac and I'm running Yosemite 10.10.5. so wot's all the bother about? I can still take pics on my iPhone/Pad which immediately upload to the main 'puter. The machine does everything I need it to do (which included all my inputs for Axminster) so I really can't be ar$ed to faff around with changing it. Why bother? - Rob
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Re: Is your iMac or Macbook getting long in the tooth ?

Postby RogerS » 24 Sep 2020, 16:17

Woodbloke wrote:
Andyp wrote:Most of that has gone over my head. But as my iMac is 11 years old now I have been following Roger's recent travails with interest


As is my iMac and I'm running Yosemite 10.10.5. so wot's all the bother about? I can still take pics on my iPhone/Pad which immediately upload to the main 'puter. The machine does everything I need it to do (which included all my inputs for Axminster) so I really can't be ar$ed to faff around with changing it. Why bother? - Rob


Well, Rob, it depends on. how important your photos are to you. Assuming you are still on iphoto.
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Re: Is your iMac or Macbook getting long in the tooth ?

Postby Woodbloke » 24 Sep 2020, 17:06

RogerS wrote:
Well, Rob, it depends on. how important your photos are to you. Assuming you are still on iphoto.


Mine are as important to me as yours are to you Rog, but I still have them all on iPhoto and they're all backed up on a 2T hardrive wot sits under the iMac. Currently I have 13,428 pics :D - Rob
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Re: Is your iMac or Macbook getting long in the tooth ?

Postby Andyp » 24 Sep 2020, 17:42

Woodbloke wrote:
RogerS wrote:
Well, Rob, it depends on. how important your photos are to you. Assuming you are still on iphoto.


Mine are as important to me as yours are to you Rog, but I still have them all on iPhoto and they're all backed up on a 2T hardrive wot sits under the iMac. Currently I have 13,428 pics :D - Rob


If I understand correctly what Roger is warning us about is when the time comes to replace the iMac* you wont loose the photos obviously but expecting to transfer in the same album and sort structure etc is not going to be a easy. Whether those helpful chaps in the Apple store can help I do not know but I think Roger has said in the past that access for him at his local one is not easy.


*I dont wish to tempt fate but even iMacs don’t last forever.
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Re: Is your iMac or Macbook getting long in the tooth ?

Postby RogerS » 24 Sep 2020, 18:06

Andyp wrote:
Woodbloke wrote:
RogerS wrote:
Well, Rob, it depends on. how important your photos are to you. Assuming you are still on iphoto.


Mine are as important to me as yours are to you Rog, but I still have them all on iPhoto and they're all backed up on a 2T hardrive wot sits under the iMac. Currently I have 13,428 pics :D - Rob


If I understand correctly what Roger is warning us about is when the time comes to replace the iMac* you wont loose the photos obviously but expecting to transfer in the same album and sort structure etc is not going to be a easy. Whether those helpful chaps in the Apple store can help I do not know but I think Roger has said in the past that access for him at his local one is not easy.


*I dont wish to tempt fate but even iMacs don’t last forever.


You've got it in one, Andy. And don't assume that the guys in the Apple store can help either as I spent time in a chat session with Apple and once I gave them the serial number of the old Mac, they said that they could not offer any support as it was so old. Which at 13 years is pretty fair, IMO.

So my reasoning is still valid...if the gap between Mac vintages is too great, then you're in for a load of hassle.

And moving onto backups....a lot of people make clones of their Mac system. Which is all well and good and perfect for those instances when your Mac goes doo-lally and you need to restore it back to its former glory.

But what are you going to do next year if the h/w goes Pop? Chances are that the new Mac you have your eye on is going to be on Apple chips and not Intel. So that clone backup is not much use at least as far as the OS is concerned. I have no idea how/what/why/when the actual apps are going to be affected...must Google that one.

OK..I hear you say.."I'll use Migration Assistant" to which I refer the Honourable Gentleman to my other thread where I waxed lyrical on how Migration Assistant trashed the OS on my new iMac. :lol:
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Re: Is your iMac or Macbook getting long in the tooth ?

Postby Woodbloke » 24 Sep 2020, 18:08

Andyp wrote:
Woodbloke wrote:
RogerS wrote:
Well, Rob, it depends on. how important your photos are to you. Assuming you are still on iphoto.


Mine are as important to me as yours are to you Rog, but I still have them all on iPhoto and they're all backed up on a 2T hardrive wot sits under the iMac. Currently I have 13,428 pics :D - Rob


If I understand correctly what Roger is warning us about is when the time comes to replace the iMac* you wont loose the photos obviously but expecting to transfer in the same album and sort structure etc is not going to be a easy. Whether those helpful chaps in the Apple store can help I do not know but I think Roger has said in the past that access for him at his local one is not easy.


*I dont wish to tempt fate but even iMacs don’t last forever.

I can see what Roger is driving at, but it's not the chaps in the Apple store who can help 'cos they're for the most part are just hard pushed and harassed shop assistants who have a lot of other folk to deal with. I've said it before, the people who really know what you can and can't do are the chaps in NI on the Apple Help Desk, who will quite literally spend as much time with you as is required to sort out any particular issue. Were I to change my Imac at some future date, I would certainly check with the Help Desk to see exactly what I needed to do to migrate my pics from the old machine to the new one. They're there to help and they've got me out of some very 'iffy' :eusa-whistle: scrapes in the past - Rob
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Re: Is your iMac or Macbook getting long in the tooth ?

Postby RogerS » 24 Sep 2020, 18:10

Woodbloke wrote:
Andyp wrote:
Woodbloke wrote:
Mine are as important to me as yours are to you Rog, but I still have them all on iPhoto and they're all backed up on a 2T hardrive wot sits under the iMac. Currently I have 13,428 pics :D - Rob


If I understand correctly what Roger is warning us about is when the time comes to replace the iMac* you wont loose the photos obviously but expecting to transfer in the same album and sort structure etc is not going to be a easy. Whether those helpful chaps in the Apple store can help I do not know but I think Roger has said in the past that access for him at his local one is not easy.


*I dont wish to tempt fate but even iMacs don’t last forever.

I can see what Roger is driving at, but it's not the chaps in the Apple store who can help 'cos they're for the most part are just hard pushed and harassed shop assistants who have a lot of other folk to deal with. I've said it before, the people who really know what you can and can't do are the chaps in NI on the Apple Help Desk, who will quite literally spend as much time with you as is required to sort out any particular issue. Were I to change my Imac at some future date, I would certainly check with the Help Desk to see exactly what I needed to do to migrate my pics from the old machine to the new one. They're there to help and they've got me out of some very 'iffy' :eusa-whistle: scrapes in the past - Rob


You're still missing the point, Rob. Who do you think I was talking to when they told me that moving my photos from iPhoto on the old Mac to the new iMac was NOT supported and that they could NOT help?
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Re: Is your iMac or Macbook getting long in the tooth ?

Postby RogerS » 24 Sep 2020, 18:11

Quick Google re Apple chips and existing Apps.

First, you'll be able to compile your app to run both on Intel-based Macs and ARM-based Macs. You can ship those apps with both executables using a new format called Universal 2. If you've been using a Mac for a while, you know that Apple used the same process when it switched from PowerPC CPUs to Intel CPUs -- one app, two executables. As for unoptimized software, you'll still be able to run those apps. But its performances won't be as good as what you'd get from a native ARM-ready app. Apple is going to ship Rosetta 2, an emulation layer that lets you run old apps on new Macs.

When you install an old app, your Mac will examine the app and try to optimize it for your ARM processor. This way, there will be some level of optimization even before you open the app. But what if it's a web browser or a complicated app with just-in-time code? Rosetta 2 can also translate instructions from x86 to ARM on the fly, while you're running the app. And if you're a developer working on code that is going to run on servers, Apple is also working on a set of virtualization tools. You'll be able to run Linux and Docker on an ARM Mac.

As a bonus, users will also be able to access a much larger library of apps. "Mac users can for the first time run iOS and iPadOS apps on the Mac," Apple CEO Tim Cook said. While the company didn't share a lot of details, Apple isn't talking about Catalyst, its own framework that makes it easier to port iOS apps to macOS. You should be able to download and run apps even if the developer never optimized those apps for macOS.
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Re: Is your iMac or Macbook getting long in the tooth ?

Postby Woodbloke » 24 Sep 2020, 19:19

RogerS wrote:
You're still missing the point, Rob. Who do you think I was talking to when they told me that moving my photos from iPhoto on the old Mac to the new iMac was NOT supported and that they could NOT help?


OK, so it can't be done as you suggest, but why can't you upload your existing pics on the old iMac to a series of usbs and then download them onto the new machine? It would take some time and were I to do it I'd be inclined to weed out all the duplicates (of which SWIMBO has created plenty :eusa-whistle: ) to probably reduce the quantity by at least 40% - Rob
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Re: Is your iMac or Macbook getting long in the tooth ?

Postby RogerS » 24 Sep 2020, 21:53

Woodbloke wrote:
RogerS wrote:
You're still missing the point, Rob. Who do you think I was talking to when they told me that moving my photos from iPhoto on the old Mac to the new iMac was NOT supported and that they could NOT help?


OK, so it can't be done as you suggest, but why can't you upload your existing pics on the old iMac to a series of usbs and then download them onto the new machine? It would take some time and were I to do it I'd be inclined to weed out all the duplicates (of which SWIMBO has created plenty :eusa-whistle: ) to probably reduce the quantity by at least 40% - Rob


True. But (a) how much time have you got to waste doing that ? (b) lot of people overlay their library with albums etc and organised photos....exporting loses all that. But Hey..you do what you want, Rob. If that approach floats your boat then go for it.
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Re: Is your iMac or Macbook getting long in the tooth ?

Postby TrimTheKing » 24 Sep 2020, 22:50

So I refer you back to my original solution. It really wouldn’t be that much of a faff and I’m surprised the Apple geeks didn’t suggest it as an option because I can 100% guarantee you that I’ve done it, and it worked.
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Re: Is your iMac or Macbook getting long in the tooth ?

Postby Woodster » 24 Sep 2020, 23:26

I don’t use iPhoto, and I don’t like software programs that want to import my photos into a catalog. I know lots of photographers like this approach but I don’t. All my photos are stored on external drives and if I edit any then a separate version of it is stored to a relevant location.

Rather than using any type of automated migration method could you not just export your photos to a hard disk from the old machine and then re-import them to the new one?

Edit: sorry, took too long to reply and I’ve just noticed someone has suggested this. :oops:

Anything useful here:

https://discussions.apple.com/docs/DOC-8461
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Re: Is your iMac or Macbook getting long in the tooth ?

Postby Rod » 24 Sep 2020, 23:56

My MacBook is a mid 2009 version and not all functions work properly. I’ve also got photos on my phone going back many many years and they’ve all migrated to my new iMac with no issues at all.
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Re: Is your iMac or Macbook getting long in the tooth ?

Postby RogerS » 25 Sep 2020, 05:39

TrimTheKing wrote:So I refer you back to my original solution. It really wouldn’t be that much of a faff and I’m surprised the Apple geeks didn’t suggest it as an option because I can 100% guarantee you that I’ve done it, and it worked.


Where do you get all the versions of OSX from ? I can't find them.

I know your solution works as you've done it. But for most of us mere mortals, I think it would be a struggle and a lot of research on how to do it all. Certainly I would find it hard and I rate myself a little bit above your average Mac user.
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Re: Is your iMac or Macbook getting long in the tooth ?

Postby Andyp » 25 Sep 2020, 07:25

Woodbloke wrote:
Andyp wrote:Most of that has gone over my head. But as my iMac is 11 years old now I have been following Roger's recent travails with interest


As is my iMac and I'm running Yosemite 10.10.5. so wot's all the bother about? I can still take pics on my iPhone/Pad which immediately upload to the main 'puter. The machine does everything I need it to do (which included all my inputs for Axminster) so I really can't be ar$ed to faff around with changing it. Why bother? - Rob


Rob, as you are running 10.10.5 you should , if not then you could, be running Photos rather than iPhoto.
Again if I understand correctly it is only the transfer from iPhoto to Photos while at the same time upgrading to the OSX in a new Mac with a different chipset that causes the problem. HTH.
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Re: Is your iMac or Macbook getting long in the tooth ?

Postby RogerS » 25 Sep 2020, 07:47

Andyp wrote:....
....
Again if I understand correctly it is only the transfer from iPhoto to Photos while at the same time upgrading to the OSX in a new Mac with a different chipset that causes the problem. HTH.


No, two separate issues, Andy. My fault for confusing things.
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Re: Is your iMac or Macbook getting long in the tooth ?

Postby TrimTheKing » 25 Sep 2020, 07:59

RogerS wrote:
TrimTheKing wrote:So I refer you back to my original solution. It really wouldn’t be that much of a faff and I’m surprised the Apple geeks didn’t suggest it as an option because I can 100% guarantee you that I’ve done it, and it worked.


Where do you get all the versions of OSX from ? I can't find them.

I know your solution works as you've done it. But for most of us mere mortals, I think it would be a struggle and a lot of research on how to do it all. Certainly I would find it hard and I rate myself a little bit above your average Mac user.


That’s the question.

You can find 10.10-10.12 here https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/appleins ... apple/amp/

Others it appears you can find in your Apple
Account if you have downloaded them previously, but not if not.

There are ways though. You need to work out what versions you need. Again some googling will no doubt enable you to work out the compatibility path.
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