It is currently 10 Dec 2019, 11:26

Small workshop

Roll up, roll up. Here you will find everything from new workshop designs, through builds to completed workshop tours. All magnificently overseen by our own Mike G and his tremendously thorough 'Shed' design and generous advice.

Small workshop

Postby MY63 » 26 Oct 2018, 14:07

Hello everyone I am currently planning to build a small workshop its main purpose is to be a new home for my leatherwork. I do have some woodworking tools and general tools that will also live there.
I will be replacing an existing shed that was here when we moved in 20 years ago and it was old then :).
The workshop I have in mind will be 3.6 m x 2.4 m height wise I would like to stay under the 2.5 m planning limit I think I may have misunderstood this as rereading it there is reference to eaves height,
This would change my roof choice as I was planning a pent roof however if the rules refer to eaves height then I may change to a pitched roof, this would allow me some storage in the roof for larger hides.
If I keep it under 15 sq m I would also be able to build without involving the building inspector.
This does not mean I want to build a substandard workshop I want to have the best workshop possible for my limited budget.
I have been reading the posts here for some time and am itching to get started I have been delayed by the need to rebuild both sides of our garden fence following storm damage.

I have tried to design my workshop with Sketchup but I have struggled with it I much prefer a pencil and paper.
I am very much an average DIYer although I do have some physical limitations following a life changing accident some years ago.

For the base I am thinking of the concrete lintel as suggested by Mike G on a foundation of crushed stone
building up from there in wood as per Mike's plan.
I have spoken to my local timber merchant who is able to supply everything I need with the exception of the crushed stone and the roofing material.

My first questions are

Does the 2.5 m height restriction refer to the eaves or to the uppermost part of the roof?

What secures the concrete lintel to the base stone I ask this as laying mortar will be one of the tasks that I will find difficult given my limitations. I have limited use of my right hand / arm and although I have learned to do many things with my left hand trowel work may not be one of them.

If the lintels need to be fixed in place could I use something like post mix using some sort of shuttering.

I like to document my leatherwork on my blog so others may learn from me and I would like to do the same with this build both here and my own blog.

I would appreciate any advice

Michael
MY63
Nordic Pine
 
Posts: 579
Joined: 17 Oct 2018, 20:41
Location: North East England
Name: Michael

Re: Small workshop

Postby Malc2098 » 26 Oct 2018, 15:17

Good for you, Michael!

I don't think I can answer your technical questions, but this lot got me going to build my own workshop and I picked up a few skills on the way and a huge amount of knowledge, support and encouragement from these guys.

Someone will have answers and options for you shortly, I'm sure.
Malcolm
User avatar
Malc2098
Old Oak
 
Posts: 3599
Joined: 03 Jul 2016, 11:10
Location: Tiverton
Name: Malcolm

Re: Small workshop

Postby RogerS » 26 Oct 2018, 15:34

MY63 wrote:.....
If I keep it under 15 sq m I would also be able to build without involving the building inspector.......


Isn't it 30 sq m ?

Edit:....


Yup.

If the floor area of the building is between 15 square metres and 30 square metres, you will not normally be required to apply for building regulations approval providing that the building contains NO sleeping accommodation and is either at least one metre from any boundary or it is constructed substantially of non-combustible materials.
Fewer Smart things. More smart people.
User avatar
RogerS
Sequoia
 
Posts: 6447
Joined: 21 Jul 2014, 21:07
Location: Nearly finished. OK OK...call me Pinocchio.
Name:

Re: Small workshop

Postby MY63 » 26 Oct 2018, 18:40

RogerS wrote:
MY63 wrote:.....
If I keep it under 15 sq m I would also be able to build without involving the building inspector.......


Isn't it 30 sq m ?

Edit:....


Yup.

If the floor area of the building is between 15 square metres and 30 square metres, you will not normally be required to apply for building regulations approval providing that the building contains NO sleeping accommodation and is either at least one metre from any boundary or it is constructed substantially of non-combustible materials.



Thanks Roger

I wonder if my Local Authority have different rules or I may be confusing building regs and Planning.
This is from their website..

"Small detached buildings (such as small garages and sheds) are exempt from Building Regulations when:
they are less than 15m2 in floor area
they contain no sleeping accommodation
any fixed electrical installations comply with the applicable Building Regulations requirements"

It is clear to me that I am confusing Planning and building regs.

So it will have to be a maximum height of 2.5 m as it will only be 1 m from the fence.
MY63
Nordic Pine
 
Posts: 579
Joined: 17 Oct 2018, 20:41
Location: North East England
Name: Michael

Re: Small workshop

Postby 9fingers » 26 Oct 2018, 19:10

Have a look in the Dropbox. There is a folder full of Permitted Development Rights stuff.

Bob
Image
Information on induction motors here
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B_GZrX ... sp=sharing
Email:motors@minchin.org.uk
User avatar
9fingers
Sequoia
 
Posts: 5389
Joined: 21 Jul 2014, 20:22
Location: Romsey Hampshire between Southampton and the New Forest
Name: Bob

Re: Small workshop

Postby MY63 » 26 Oct 2018, 20:07

9fingers wrote:Have a look in the Dropbox. There is a folder full of Permitted Development Rights stuff.

Bob


Thanks Bob
I see where I went wrong the distance from the boundary fence is my limiting factor.
Overhead storage would have been nice however I would like some headroom inside so I think a pent style roof would be best. I can get creative with under bench storage for my leather some of it is sensitive to light and all f it must be kept dry.
Thanks
Michael
MY63
Nordic Pine
 
Posts: 579
Joined: 17 Oct 2018, 20:41
Location: North East England
Name: Michael

Re: Small workshop

Postby Malc2098 » 26 Oct 2018, 20:25

Just had a look at your wordpress site, Michael.

Your work looks stunning. I particularly like the camera shoulder strap and the repurposed cutlery box.
Malcolm
User avatar
Malc2098
Old Oak
 
Posts: 3599
Joined: 03 Jul 2016, 11:10
Location: Tiverton
Name: Malcolm

Re: Small workshop

Postby Mike G » 27 Oct 2018, 11:37

MY63 wrote:.......What secures the concrete lintel to the base stone........


Gravity.

Ideally you would fix the lintels to each other at the corners, with a bracket screwed & plugged into the inside face of each lintel, but this isn't critical. It isn't critical because the timber fame you sit on the top of the lintels is strapped to them, and because the timber structure is fixed together at the corners and then fixed to the lintels, the whole thing should act as one, and be secure and sound.

I suppose if you were building a tall shed on a small footprint in a particularly exposed and windy location (such as the Orkneys, for instance), you might drive some reinforcing rods into the ground and strap them to the lintels, just to make sure the shed didn't blow over, but in ordinary circumstances gravity alone is plenty enough with a building like this.

I can also confirm that the Building Inspector won't be interested in your building unless it exceeds 30 sq metres, unless you are within a metre of the boundary or it contains living accommodation (a "habitable room"). You will however have to have the electrical work certified by an electrician. Many will allow you to do the work, and then just fit a consumer unit, inspect and test.

Good luck with your build, and there's always plenty of help here if you run into issues.
User avatar
Mike G
Old Oak
 
Posts: 4310
Joined: 30 Jul 2014, 22:36
Location: Somewhat less of a hovel
Name:

Re: Small workshop

Postby MY63 » 27 Oct 2018, 20:24

Thanks Malcolm I appreciate your compliment the camera strap was the first in a series but my friend who was helping with camera input has been unwell so the project has come to a halt for now.
Mike I very much welcome your input, I think I am about ready to start.
I am planning on using 4 x 2 for the studs and 6 x 2 for the joists or their regulated equivalent that is what the timber merchant called it.

I have done a basic drawing using cm for m to help me to work out the amount of timber to order but I am still unsure.
I plan to have double doors at one end and as large a window as I can find /scavenge / acquire on the tall side.
400 mm spacing for the joists and 600 mm for the studs a double plate on top of the frames and whatever Pent roof I can make without loosing too much height but with all the insulation and the correct air space between.

If there is a quick formula for working out the amount of timber required if not I am going to re read some of the builds on here and make more notes regarding doors and windows or and of course rooves.

Thanks for the input.
Michael
MY63
Nordic Pine
 
Posts: 579
Joined: 17 Oct 2018, 20:41
Location: North East England
Name: Michael

Re: Small workshop

Postby Malc2098 » 27 Oct 2018, 21:36

I was lousy at calculating timber and in the end I always over ordered, but have used much of what was over ordered both in and since the build.

You can never have enough 25x50 roofing battens. They got used as counter battens for my walls. They extended the depth of my roof (because the insulation seconds we're 120mm not 100mm). They got used as jigs all over the place. I've used 45x95 and 45x145 for chocking up stuff.

So if you can calculate to there or there abouts, add a bit. It will always be useful.
Malcolm
User avatar
Malc2098
Old Oak
 
Posts: 3599
Joined: 03 Jul 2016, 11:10
Location: Tiverton
Name: Malcolm

Re: Small workshop

Postby MY63 » 28 Oct 2018, 13:30

Thanks Malcolm I enjoyed reading your build.
I am trying to do some simple drawings to help me to work out what timber I require although I will be building some work benches inside so any left over timber will get used.

Image2018-10-28_11-51-23 by my0771, on Flickr

I am following Mike G's plan for use of lintels rather than a concrete base. so insert his details drawings here.
I was going with 100 mm roof insulation although I had a panic about internal headroom and reduced it to 75 mm I may revert to 100 mm.
I also need to consider overhangs for the roof.
Does everyone get the feeling that what they are planning is not big enough. I could go out to 3 m x 4 m this may drive me mad :D although I don't think I have far to go.
The more I read on here I think I really need a bandsaw.

As you can see any help appreciated

Michael
MY63
Nordic Pine
 
Posts: 579
Joined: 17 Oct 2018, 20:41
Location: North East England
Name: Michael

Re: Small workshop

Postby RogerS » 28 Oct 2018, 14:07

Michael

Where in NE England are you ?
Fewer Smart things. More smart people.
User avatar
RogerS
Sequoia
 
Posts: 6447
Joined: 21 Jul 2014, 21:07
Location: Nearly finished. OK OK...call me Pinocchio.
Name:

Re: Small workshop

Postby Mike G » 28 Oct 2018, 14:18

Yep, Michael, you certainly need roof overhangs. Even 100mm will help a lot.
User avatar
Mike G
Old Oak
 
Posts: 4310
Joined: 30 Jul 2014, 22:36
Location: Somewhat less of a hovel
Name:

Re: Small workshop

Postby MY63 » 28 Oct 2018, 17:22

RogerS wrote:Michael

Where in NE England are you ?


Hi Roger I am 7 miles east of Newcastle upon Tyne 1.5 miles from the beach.


Mike G wrote:Yep, Michael, you certainly need roof overhangs. Even 100mm will help a lot.


I have to be honest I was more focused on the foundations and walls at this point, I had not really considered the roof structure as there are not that many examples of a pent roof.
MY63
Nordic Pine
 
Posts: 579
Joined: 17 Oct 2018, 20:41
Location: North East England
Name: Michael

Re: Small workshop

Postby RogerS » 28 Oct 2018, 18:23

MY63 wrote:
RogerS wrote:Michael

Where in NE England are you ?


Hi Roger I am 7 miles east of Newcastle upon Tyne 1.5 miles from the beach.

....


Ah, sensible man. You're in the dry part :D I'm not a million miles away from you due West..just off the A69 and very near Haltwhistle. If you're ever passing, you're very welcome to pop in.
Fewer Smart things. More smart people.
User avatar
RogerS
Sequoia
 
Posts: 6447
Joined: 21 Jul 2014, 21:07
Location: Nearly finished. OK OK...call me Pinocchio.
Name:

Re: Small workshop

Postby MY63 » 28 Oct 2018, 20:20

Thanks for the invitation Roger if I am ever heading that way I will let you know.
Does anyone know if there is a workshop build with a pent roof listed on this site I have read many builds but I am currently reading Mike G’s extension build (page 38) of 118 it has s like a book.
Michael
MY63
Nordic Pine
 
Posts: 579
Joined: 17 Oct 2018, 20:41
Location: North East England
Name: Michael

Re: Small workshop

Postby Coolhands » 28 Oct 2018, 20:26

My one?
User avatar
Coolhands
New Shoots
 
Posts: 81
Joined: 03 Apr 2018, 20:39
Location: Edgware, London
Name:

Re: Small workshop

Postby MY63 » 28 Oct 2018, 21:22

Coolhands wrote:My one?

Thanks I had read your thread but before you started the roof I am up to date now good work btw.
MY63
Nordic Pine
 
Posts: 579
Joined: 17 Oct 2018, 20:41
Location: North East England
Name: Michael

Re: Small workshop

Postby MY63 » 29 Oct 2018, 23:13

I have almost completed my timber list I think I have thought of most of the items I have read about here.
However I do have a couple of questions,
What size timber do I need to close off the ends of the roof space.
Insulation is there a particular type that I need for floor walls and roof and why is it so expensive.
MY63
Nordic Pine
 
Posts: 579
Joined: 17 Oct 2018, 20:41
Location: North East England
Name: Michael

Re: Small workshop

Postby RogerS » 30 Oct 2018, 07:55

MY63 wrote:.....
Insulation is there a particular type that I need for floor walls and roof and why is it so expensive.


Try seconds.co.uk for cheaper insulation. Or any of the other 'seconds' outlets online such as eBay.

Where are you getting your timber from ? Lathams in Gateshead ?
Fewer Smart things. More smart people.
User avatar
RogerS
Sequoia
 
Posts: 6447
Joined: 21 Jul 2014, 21:07
Location: Nearly finished. OK OK...call me Pinocchio.
Name:

Re: Small workshop

Postby Rod » 30 Oct 2018, 11:34

I used Rockwool batts which are much cheaper

Rod
User avatar
Rod
Old Oak
 
Posts: 4087
Joined: 21 Jul 2014, 21:34
Location: Winchester, Hampshire
Name:

Re: Small workshop

Postby Mike G » 30 Oct 2018, 12:05

Rod wrote:I used Rockwool batts which are much cheaper......


So did I, but it is important to remember that they are approximately half as good an insulator as Celotex (other PIR insulation is available).
User avatar
Mike G
Old Oak
 
Posts: 4310
Joined: 30 Jul 2014, 22:36
Location: Somewhat less of a hovel
Name:

Re: Small workshop

Postby MY63 » 30 Oct 2018, 16:04

RogerS wrote:
MY63 wrote:.....
Insulation is there a particular type that I need for floor walls and roof and why is it so expensive.


Try seconds.co.uk for cheaper insulation. Or any of the other 'seconds' outlets online such as eBay.

Where are you getting your timber from ? Lathams in Gateshead ?



Hi Roger

There is a small family owned timber merchants near me called Percy Hudson my Dad used to take me there when I was a child so I have always gone there. I have not really checked the prices with other suppliers but they are cheaper than the big stores and they are a local business.
47 x 100 c16 regularised is £1.80 per metre and 47 x 100 c16 is £2.71.

I looked at the insulation seconds on ebay and they are the same price as I can buy new locally I think if the mineral wool will work then I will get some prices. If it was for the house then I would go with the boards.
If I buy Kingspan insulation which is 1200 x 2400 for £46.50 it will cost £279 for the floor and roof which is ok.
They seem to think the insulation requires an air gap within the frame so in the walls they reccomend 75 mm kingspan with 25 mm air gap before the membrane.
I had assumed the idea was to fill the gap between the frames and have the air gap outside of that created by the additional timber and the cladding.

Incidentally they did have some expanded polystyrene 50 mm @ £10 for an 8 x 4 sheet.


Michael
MY63
Nordic Pine
 
Posts: 579
Joined: 17 Oct 2018, 20:41
Location: North East England
Name: Michael

Re: Small workshop

Postby MY63 » 02 Nov 2018, 20:29

Ok I have made a decision the supplier has told me they only stock concrete lintels in 1.2 and 1.8 m so my workshop is going to be 2.4m x 3.6m as per my original plan.
I am also going to use mineral wool for the insulation.
If my joists are 150 mm and the insulation is 100 mm what supports the insulation and does that prevent mice from moving in.
Thanks
Michael
MY63
Nordic Pine
 
Posts: 579
Joined: 17 Oct 2018, 20:41
Location: North East England
Name: Michael

Re: Small workshop

Postby 9fingers » 02 Nov 2018, 20:41

MY63 wrote:Ok I have made a decision the supplier has told me they only stock concrete lintels in 1.2 and 1.8 m so my workshop is going to be 2.4m x 3.6m as per my original plan.
I am also going to use mineral wool for the insulation.
If my joists are 150 mm and the insulation is 100 mm what supports the insulation and does that prevent mice from moving in.
Thanks
Michael



Don't forget to allow for the corners in the overall dimensions.
Possibly going to be 2.6 x 3.6 or 2.4 x 3.8 or 2.5 x 3.7

Bob
Image
Information on induction motors here
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B_GZrX ... sp=sharing
Email:motors@minchin.org.uk
User avatar
9fingers
Sequoia
 
Posts: 5389
Joined: 21 Jul 2014, 20:22
Location: Romsey Hampshire between Southampton and the New Forest
Name: Bob

Next

Return to Workshop Builds

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests