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'Nook" Table - finished

This is where we don't want anything but evidence of your finest wood butchering in all its glorious, and photograph laden glory. Bring your finished products or WIP's, we love them all, so long as there's pictures, and plenty of 'em!

Re: 'Nook" Table

Postby johnward » 01 Dec 2021, 10:23

Very interesting and skillful work Stuart.

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Re: 'Nook" Table

Postby Stuart » 01 Dec 2021, 17:20

Thank you for the encouraging words, with people watching I really do have to get this right!

I'm not convinced a lathe turned set of corners wouldn't have provided another set of issues. The size of the bit and the depth required (40mm x 320mm) would have made it a bit of a challenge and separating accurately in to 4 parts would also make life interesting. I'm not (currently!) unhappy with what I've got or how I got here, it was in fact much easier than I'd envisaged.

Todays adventures. Cutting dominoes and gluing up the top and bottom panels.

Years ago I made some panel clamping aids (I can't for the life of me remember the proper name! - cauls?) but as they've been in storage for quite a while they'd moved considerably so I decided to shorten them, re-plane the desired gentle curve and reapply parcel tape to prevent adhesive sticking.
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Panel aids
(221.76 KiB)

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Taped
(254.38 KiB)

Then it was time to cut for the dominoes (4mm). I bought the machine a while ago and whilst it doesn't get masses of uses I find it much more accurate than my biscuit jointer. I taped a thiner piece of scrap to the bench and with a couple of bench stops (old black & decker plastic ones) I had a decent set up.
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Offcut and stops
(133.52 KiB)

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Dom
(149.75 KiB)

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Cutting finished
(299.99 KiB)

I have one domino set to the tight fitting and the others to a slack setting. I find this gives the accuracy I want but a slightly more relaxed glue up not having to fight to get dominoes in their respective slots.
Then it was time to glue up! Nothing fancy, just PVA but had to work fairly quick as there's 5 joints per piece and dominoes to insert. Completely uneventful which leaves me worrying even more about a visit from the cock-up fairy!
IMG_0877.JPG
Glue up
(157.21 KiB)

And relax!

Edit - Andy, rotating and saving then rotating back again seems to post pictures as intended!
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Re: 'Nook" Table

Postby Stuart » 03 Dec 2021, 17:47

Cleaning up squeeze out and a light plane for the top and bottom.
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Planing top
(230.2 KiB)

Unfortunately, it started to tear out so I had to resort to my favourite, battered scraper
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Tear out
(223.03 KiB)
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Scraper
(176.62 KiB)

Sanded to 120 using a mirka pad. I love it as it helps keep a nice flat surface. I know an ordinary block is just as good but I’ve got this so why not? With mirka ‘paper’ it’s a brilliant bit of kit.
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Sanding
(95.91 KiB)

Cut to size. I pondered long and hard about the breadboard edge and decided to go with a loose tongue as it would be easier to glue the tongue to the round edge and then attach to the top and bottom. I really didn’t feel that trying to attach the tongue breadboard style to the curved edge would work, with only 10mm to play with I could foresee problems.
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Cut to size
(193.12 KiB)

Cutting tongues from the previously discarded wild grain bits
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Tongues
(166.73 KiB)

A bit of a tickle with the plane to make them all fit
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Palning tongues
(234.24 KiB)

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Tongues & corners
(337.21 KiB)

Sides were a reasonably simple glue up. Cut over size to allow for a decision on height of the opening.
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Sides glue up
(304.31 KiB)

I can’t remember the last time I used the little sticky up doohickey on the front of the vice! Ideal for holding the sides for clean up.
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Side cleanup
(298.76 KiB)

Despite the previous drawing I wasn’t convinced about the height of the opening so decided a sort of mock up was required so a couple of bits of tape later
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Mock up 1
(273.35 KiB)

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Mock up 2
(288.94 KiB)

We’ve decided on the slightly narrower opening which means the sides will be about 55mm so I’m wondering whether they could be ‘fully’ glued instead of breadboarding them?
Any thoughts?
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Re: 'Nook" Table

Postby Malc2098 » 03 Dec 2021, 18:29

Like it!
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Re: 'Nook" Table

Postby spb » 03 Dec 2021, 19:06

Stuart wrote:We’ve decided on the slightly narrower opening which means the sides will be about 55mm so I’m wondering whether they could be ‘fully’ glued instead of breadboarding them?
Any thoughts?

Which way is the grain going on the sides? If it's front to back and aligned with the corner pieces, then there's no issue gluing them. If it's up and down, at right angles to the corner pieces, then it's the long dimension across the grain that matters when considering movement, and they'll most likely want breadboards or equivalent.
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Re: 'Nook" Table

Postby 9fingers » 03 Dec 2021, 20:22

spb wrote:
Stuart wrote:We’ve decided on the slightly narrower opening which means the sides will be about 55mm so I’m wondering whether they could be ‘fully’ glued instead of breadboarding them?
Any thoughts?

Which way is the grain going on the sides? If it's front to back and aligned with the corner pieces, then there's no issue gluing them. If it's up and down, at right angles to the corner pieces, then it's the long dimension across the grain that matters when considering movement, and they'll most likely want breadboards or equivalent.


This is the big problem that others identified with making this type of sleeve and I was hoping to see a solution that removed the movement problem.
Breadboards have never been a favourite technique of mine as it does not fix the expansion problem but instead gives the opportunity to locate the movement in a less visible place.

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Re: 'Nook" Table

Postby Stuart » 03 Dec 2021, 23:06

I don’t think, given the choosen construction method there’s any choice but to go ‘breadboard’. Anything else is almost certainly going to have problems down the road due to movement.

I’m not particularly looking forward to the next stage which is lots of grooving and fitting of tongues but still hopeful (at present!) that if I’m careful it’ll work out.
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Re: 'Nook" Table

Postby Stuart » 07 Dec 2021, 14:50

Latest progress. Carefully resetting of the router table to cut the grooves in the top and bottom to match those on the corners.
IMG_0893.JPG
Grooving
(256.82 KiB)

Rinse and repeat for top, bottom and both sides then spent some time squaring up the grooves. I want maximum tongue thickness especially at the edges due to the need to dowel.

When all that was done time for the first dry fit and lo, - the cock up fairies visit is revealed!
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Dry fit
(274.93 KiB)

At first glance not too bad. Closer examination reveals the issue
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Cock up 1
(227.12 KiB)

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Cock up 2
(127.51 KiB)

I've clearly removed far too much material on the edges of the corner blocks so in effect they've been 'undercut' and are now smaller than the thickness of the top/bottom.
Fortunately, the inside is actually quite a nice fit,
IMG_0897.JPG
Inside
(202.6 KiB)

As I see it I have a number of options:
1) Change the design
2) Use filler and paint
3) Sand like crazy and try and 'fair in' the corners with their respective top/bottom/side.
4) Start again and make new corners
5) Let in new edges to the corner blocks

1 and 2 will remain options until I have a finished product! I started off not really keen on the design but have grown to quite like it so I will make every effort to finish as intended. 3 would end up with different shapes to the corners and to me at least, just wouldn't look right.
4 is an option and I have enough wood but a late night bout of insomnia made me think about 5.

Diagrams to explain. This is an exaggeration of existing
side 1.jpg
As is
(56.55 KiB)

This is what I'm thinking of doing
Side 2.jpg
Proposed
(60.6 KiB)

By routing out a small amount of the edge I give myself an edge against which I can reference a small piece of matching wood. By planing the shoulder square to the grooved face I can them assemble and 'fair in' the new piece accurately to the top/bottom/sides.
It's a lot of work but I don't see why it shouldn't look acceptable?
If it does all go chest upwards then option 4 comes into play.

Am I mad?
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Re: 'Nook" Table

Postby NickM » 07 Dec 2021, 15:36

That’s annoying. What about option 5 with a contrasting wood instead? If you try to hide it completely and fail, then it would look like a repair attempt rather than a deliberate part of the design.
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Re: 'Nook" Table

Postby Malc2098 » 07 Dec 2021, 16:16

I'd go for contrasting wood, a bit like binding and purfling on a guitar.
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Re: 'Nook" Table

Postby Sheffield Tony » 07 Dec 2021, 16:21

Can you not plane a mil or whatever from the thickness of the flat boards to match ?
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Re: 'Nook" Table

Postby Stuart » 31 Dec 2021, 14:49

A while since the last update, progress hasn’t been rapid for all sorts of reasons but I’m getting there.

Contrasting wood was my first thought but given that the finish will include a dark stain (to match an adjacent piece of furniture) I’m not convinced it would be worth it. On that basis I decided on sapele strips as I already had off cuts that would hopefully be a close grain match.

So set up the router to take a shallow cut including a tall front fence to limit movement
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Router setup
(182.68 KiB)

This gave me the necessary rebates
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Rebates
(107.18 KiB)

Then glue in the strips and leave to dry
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Strips
(211.42 KiB)

Plane down to size
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Planning strips
(362.66 KiB)

And a trial fit
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Trial fit
(333.79 KiB)

This gave me the ‘upstand’ that I can plane back after full glue up.
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Re: 'Nook" Table

Postby Stuart » 31 Dec 2021, 15:22

Plenty of fettling and dry fits in an attempt to gets nice tight joins.
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Dry fit
(333.79 KiB)

When happier with the fit I then trimmed the corners close to final size
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Corners trimmed
(296.17 KiB)

I was reasonably happy with the way it was going together but paying a price for having the additional strips oversize which prevented getting in as close as I wanted to check the fit.

Then it was dowel manufacturing using one of Petri’s plates. Hitting appropriately sized blanks through resulted in much sapele shrapnel and swearing
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Sapele shrapnel
(252.44 KiB)

So I resorted to spinning them through with a drill and this proved much more successful
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Drill dowels
(216.39 KiB)

With everything prepared it was time to drill the joints. I ended up using a depth gauge made by my good self when at school. I gave it to my dad and rescued it from his toolbox when he died. Really useful in determining drill depth as I only wanted to have dowels showing on the undersides
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Depth gauge
(225.78 KiB)

Then with suiable depth collar a case of drilling as required using scrap tongue stock to prevent blow out internally
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Drilling joints
(199.46 KiB)

Careful marking on the tongues (previously glued to the corners) to try and ensure a nice tight pull up when dowels inserted. Middle and end dowel holes elongated to allow for movement
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Tongue holes
(215.78 KiB)

The theory being this would eliminate movemat the front and allow it at the rear where it will hopefully be less noticeable.
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Re: 'Nook" Table

Postby Stuart » 31 Dec 2021, 15:36

Then the huge fun of the glue up! I decided a single glue up would be stupid so I did it piece by piece to allow for plenty of time (!) to get everything lined up as required. Mostly it worked!
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Glue up
(296.21 KiB)

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Glue up 2
(433.08 KiB)

The final piece needed a couple of packing pieces and some strap clamps but was otherwise uneventful
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Final glue up
(385.42 KiB)

Then light trimming of the edges to ensure it was all lined up
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Trimming edges
(161.4 KiB)

Then trimming down the corners
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Corner trimming
(232.21 KiB)

Not too bad a finish
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Finished corner
(158.99 KiB)

Plenty of sanding and in honesty, some filler (hangs head in shame!)
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Final sanding
(444.96 KiB)

Inside
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Inside
(262.58 KiB)


Overall I’m not massively unhappy but a bit pee’d off at the cock ups that resulted in less than perfect joinery.
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Re: 'Nook" Table

Postby AndyT » 31 Dec 2021, 15:39

It looks pretty darn good from here. I think your persistence is paying off.
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Re: 'Nook" Table

Postby Woodbloke » 31 Dec 2021, 16:49

Stuart wrote:
Overall I’m not massively unhappy but a bit pee’d off at the cock ups that resulted in less than perfect joinery.


Looks to me like a pretty nice job. I doubt that even the best made pieces of work are completely perfick regarding the joinery; if you were to examine it closely enough, there would be faults...even filler! I know that for a fact, 'cos we used it on work made for Linely.

Were it me, I would have done an 'Alan Peters' and made the infill strips a contrasting material, so that a cock-up becomes a feature of the job - Rob
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Re: 'Nook" Table

Postby Andyp » 31 Dec 2021, 16:54

Yes, that does look good.
I do not think therefore I do not am.

cheers
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Re: 'Nook" Table

Postby Malc2098 » 31 Dec 2021, 16:58

Nice job.
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Re: 'Nook" Table

Postby 9fingers » 31 Dec 2021, 17:03

Looking good Stuart although the cross grain worries me including the end view.
I think I'd have gone for a grain wrap around on the corners by whatever means.
Still easy for me to say - at least you went ahead and made something :lol:

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Re: 'Nook" Table

Postby NickM » 31 Dec 2021, 17:38

That looks very smart.
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Re: 'Nook" Table

Postby Stuart » 31 Dec 2021, 18:43

Woodbloke wrote:Were it me, I would have done an 'Alan Peters' and made the infill strips a contrasting material, so that a cock-up becomes a feature of the job - Rob

That was an option but given that the final finish is going to be quite dark I couldn’t think of anything to give me the right sort of contrast.

I still have some wenge that I could use but not convinced it would look right.

9fingers wrote:Looking good Stuart although the cross grain worries me including the end view.
I think I'd have gone for a grain wrap around on the corners by whatever means.
Still easy for me to say - at least you went ahead and made something :lol:

Bob

Really not sure that it would have been possible to wrap that tight a radius, certainly not with my diy gear and skill level! Even if you could you’d still have ‘visual’ issues with grain direction.

Again, I’m hoping that the dark finish will help hide some of that difference, we’ll see soon.
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Re: 'Nook" Table

Postby 9fingers » 31 Dec 2021, 18:49

Stuart wrote:
9fingers wrote:Looking good Stuart although the cross grain worries me including the end view.
I think I'd have gone for a grain wrap around on the corners by whatever means.
Still easy for me to say - at least you went ahead and made something :lol:

Bob

Really not sure that it would have been possible to wrap that tight a radius, certainly not with my diy gear and skill level! Even if you could you’d still have ‘visual’ issues with grain direction.

Again, I’m hoping that the dark finish will help hide some of that difference, we’ll see soon.


My bad. I meant wrap as in the grain following around the box rather than as a constructional technique from veneers etc. It still would be made from 8 pieces glued together.

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Re: 'Nook" Table

Postby Stuart » 01 Jan 2022, 12:18

Bob, - I gave it lots of thought and garnered opinions from here and I certainly don’t think it would be an easy task to make it that way although I would like to try at some stage. I suspect plenty of material for the offcuts box!

The remaining woodworking is fairly straightforward (he says with fingers crossed!). I’ve redesigned the legs and now have a ‘crossed’ setup
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Leg redesign
(236.78 KiB)

My usual lining paper and pencil approach, gives me a much better idea of the final product than any computer package (and I like sketchup quite a lot for initial modelling). The intention is for the legs to sit within the footprint of the flat base section.
Simple leg jig made from scraps
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Leg jig
(398.84 KiB)

I’ve never been a fan of superglue in woodworking but for making jigs with a squirt of activator it’s really simple and quick.

I was initially going to use the table saw but then I’d have to incorporate serious work holding so I decided the bandsaw was a much better option (using the table saw less and less these days).
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Cutting leg taper
(387.69 KiB)

After that the jig went back where it came from!
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Scrap box
(397.22 KiB)

Cut a 10 degree slope on the top of the legs
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Top slope
(299.95 KiB)

Then a bit of a trial fit to see how it appears
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Trial fit
(372.97 KiB)

I haven’t edited this one so hopefully the forum software will turn it upside down for a better indication of how it will look.

I’m wondering if the legs are to ‘chunky’? Currently running from 50mm at the top to 35mm at the bottom over a distance of 360mm. To be linked with a 35mm rail.

Any thoughts please?
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Re: 'Nook" Table

Postby Malc2098 » 01 Jan 2022, 12:27

Maybe they could be a tad more slender to be in proportion with the thickness of the box.
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Re: 'Nook" Table - finished

Postby Stuart » 09 Jan 2022, 13:19

Decided to thin the legs and rails down by 5mm, - sometimes surprised by how much difference such a small adjustment can make.

So, some simple joinery for the rails having knocked up a trial set first
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Trial rails
(343.22 KiB)

Then the real thing
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Real rails
(290.69 KiB)

I decided on domino’s a while ago so that made life much simpler
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Domino’s
(405.68 KiB)

A quick glus up with custom clamping blocks
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Glue up
(433.01 KiB)

Buttons had previously been produced and slots cut
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Buttons
(321.64 KiB)

Then a trail fit prior to finishing
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Trial fit
(338.68 KiB)

I’d always intended to use a dark stain on this to match an existing piece. I bought this years ago in the States and love it. It’s a thick gel stain that provides a deep, lustrous finish and is an absolute doddle to use
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Stain
(469.29 KiB)

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Stained
(147.48 KiB)

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Stained 2
(519.36 KiB)

I think it gives the sapele a nice deep finish. Then it was into the finishing room (also known as the dining room!) for a couple of coats of Osmo
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Finishing room
(435.3 KiB)

I ended up using door oil as that was all I had in stock. Nice satin finish and I know from using on our doors it’s hard wearing.
A couple of days to harden off and then on with the teak wax which is another of my favourite finishing products. Again, I think a nice satin lustre.
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Finished 1
(420.03 KiB)

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Finished 2
(423.12 KiB)

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Finished 3
(457.37 KiB)

Again I’ll wait a couple of days before it goes into final position to allow the wax to harden of.

Overall I’m quite pleased as this was outside my comfort zone and the final product is pretty close to what we wanted. Interestingly, there’s already sign of movement at the rear as the top, bottom and sides shink slightly. Still, that was always going to happen and planned for.

Edit, - sorry about photo rotation. I did edit to try and stop it happening but this doesn’t seem to work on the ipad.
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