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Mr. Grumpy rants again

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Mr. Grumpy rants again

Postby sunnybob » 22 Sep 2021, 13:52

We have visitors, but they are female, so they can go out with my wife and leave me to some woodwork.
Yesterday the dishwasher died. Today I had to go get a new one. Spent 2 hours buying and bringing it back, another 2 hours making a small platform for it to get it to the right height (we seem to have above average height kitchen counters)' went and bought salt and rinse aid, and of course youve guessed it by now, it doesnt work.
Philips whirlpool. Ran for 10 minutes and then flashed an error code showing the wash pump has failed.
The shops here close at midday on weds, so I spent another half hour tracking down Philips service line Cyprus. And they wont do anything because its brand new and the shop has to authorise the repair. That means I will be the rest of the week without it, while we have visitors.

My one day this week I could have been making workshop noise and its wasted.

And as if thats not bad enough, I found the freezer had somehow been turned off (she's denying all knowledge) and had to throw away about a 100 euros worth of meat at 6 am this morning.
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Re: Mr. Grumpy rants again

Postby Lurker » 22 Sep 2021, 15:15

You have not shoved the drain hose from the machine too far into the drain pipe itself have you?
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Re: Mr. Grumpy rants again

Postby sunnybob » 22 Sep 2021, 15:28

Nope, all connected properly to the correct fittings under the sink. It will let water in, make some clonking noises, then show error code for wash pump fail, then when turning it off it will pump all the water back out.
An online search indicates this is a common problem on machines after a few years service, so now I'm beginning to regret the purchase altogether.
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Re: Mr. Grumpy rants again

Postby clogs » 22 Sep 2021, 18:47

sorry to here that.....
our dishwasher died last week as well.....it was old and not worth fixing....
have tourists renting the place...
it's taken a week from the order to get it here.....
Thats Athens to Crete, but what amazes me is that no way can u get an intergrated dishwasher here unless u buy from Ikea....
just madness....
So thats an early start for me tomorrow.....then restart on building the shed roof for the old vehicle storage....
dont ask me about our new Zanussi elec oven that has a mind of it's own.....
anything with electronics is just junk.....
and don't tell me about Bosch garbage.....thats unless it's made in Germany not Turkey.....
we have a stainless full size gas oven we use at the caravan, put it on a pallet and use that at the house over winter....no problemo....
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Re: Mr. Grumpy rants again

Postby sunnybob » 22 Sep 2021, 21:17

Our white goods are all 14 years old. The Bosch washing machine has completed many, many thousands of wash cycles, its only just now starting to be finicky about load weight for the final spin. I have no idea which country it was made in. The oven and dishwasher are Kuppersbusch, fairly sure theyre german.
The now defunct dish washer, again owes us nothing. I havent washed crockery since weve been here.
The oven is still fine.
We started with a siemens fridge, which was supposed to be a good make. It didnt last 10 years. we replaced it with a Balay, which according to rumour is a spanish bosch of questionable quality, but 5 years in and its still fine.

So philips is now bottom of my makes to buy, even if this is fixed quickly.
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Re: Mr. Grumpy rants again

Postby AJB Temple » 22 Sep 2021, 22:52

Cant you simply take it back, and reject it as totally unserviceable from day 1? I would want a nee one, not a repair.
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Re: Mr. Grumpy rants again

Postby sunnybob » 23 Sep 2021, 06:19

I am waiting for the shop to open this morning to get their response.
This particular machine was heavily discounted by almost a 150 euros due to a cosmetic dent in the front panel, which does not bother us at all as its quite small and to one side. I might even be able to push it back out if the machine is usable.
There isnt another of this model in the shop and even if there were, they would want full retail for it.
I suspect this is an easy fix which on an older machine I would happily do myself.

I can cope one more day with having to wash dishes :eusa-pray:
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Re: Mr. Grumpy rants again

Postby sunnybob » 23 Sep 2021, 16:11

After several heated phone calls, I finally managed to get an engineer (and I use that term very loosely) to come out and look.
I had told the shop, the emergency number, the shop again, and the engineer, that the display showed error code F11. That was a waste of breath.
F11 according to the internet is a wash pump failure. So he checks the electric connection, he checks the waste pipe is fitted, he checks the water is actually flowing to the machine , and then tells me it is a factory fault and he cant fix it. :eusa-doh: :eusa-doh: :eusa-doh: I knew that yesterday :evil:
Seeing as he turned up in a 20 year old beat up pickup truck and had a tool box of three screw drivers, I suspect he was the store maintenance man sent out to delay my anger.

The shop then offered to contact the REAL philips engineer, but with an open ended time frame on him actually appearing, so thats it, it will be back on the shop doorstep at 9 am tomorrow, and I shall have to pick another one.
Annoying, because it was a much fancier spec than I can afford to buy at full retail.

There was actually an amusing interlude...
I live off the road and no one can ever find me, so I always arrange to meet whoever at the village petrol station and bring them back. He calls me, I go to the station, and theres a decrepit old pick up outside. I give him the nod, he gives me the nod back, and I lead him back to my place. He walks in and get very confused.
Turns out he is a builder who is nothing to do with me. Maybe the wheel barrow in the back of the truck should have given me a clue. :eusa-whistle:
Someone else obviously has the same system. :eusa-clap:
As he is saying goodbye, the real odd job man phones again and asks why I entered the garage and drove straight past him. Seeing as both vehicles looked to be mot failure farm yard runabouts, and I was expecting a sign written service engineers van, I dont think I should be blamed. :eusa-naughty:
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Re: Mr. Grumpy rants again

Postby NickM » 23 Sep 2021, 16:51

sunnybob wrote:There was actually an amusing interlude...
I live off the road and no one can ever find me, so I always arrange to meet whoever at the village petrol station and bring them back. He calls me, I go to the station, and theres a decrepit old pick up outside. I give him the nod, he gives me the nod back, and I lead him back to my place. He walks in and get very confused.
Turns out he is a builder who is nothing to do with me. Maybe the wheel barrow in the back of the truck should have given me a clue. :eusa-whistle:
Someone else obviously has the same system. :eusa-clap:
As he is saying goodbye, the real odd job man phones again and asks why I entered the garage and drove straight past him. Seeing as both vehicles looked to be mot failure farm yard runabouts, and I was expecting a sign written service engineers van, I dont think I should be blamed. :eusa-naughty:


Maybe the builder chap would have had a better chance of fixing the dishwasher than the "engineer"!

Hope you get a decent outcome.
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Re: Mr. Grumpy rants again

Postby sunnybob » 24 Sep 2021, 11:06

I took the defective philips back this morning. and picked a Bosch instead. had to add 80 euro to the kitty though :o

But its in and it works. :eusa-dance:
No more philips products for me.

But, the rant goes on.... Inside are 30 page instruction manuals, in German, Spanish, Dutch, French, and Greek. Did you spot the glaring omission?
On asking the shop for an english manual the reply was "who uses english these days?"
To be fair, he did say he would look around for me. I a not holding my breath.

What is all this "economy" nonsense? This thing has an economy wash, it five and a half hours long :shock:
How the hell can that be economical? If I used that setting to save money, I would have to spend that and more buying more crockery so that we could eat and drink during the day :eusa-doh: :eusa-naughty:
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Re: Mr. Grumpy rants again

Postby novocaine » 24 Sep 2021, 11:14

our last machine was a bosch. It died after 10 years with a defective pump. ;)
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Re: Mr. Grumpy rants again

Postby Andyp » 24 Sep 2021, 11:22

While waiting for the retailer to find you an english manual I am sure you can find one on the Bosch website
I do not think therefore I do not am.

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Re: Mr. Grumpy rants again

Postby AJB Temple » 24 Sep 2021, 11:29

You may be judging the economy wash incorrectly. Some machines use long soak intervals, and very long air drying times, when next to no energy is used. Totally OK if you programme the machine to run overnight.

The economy mode on our machine (Miele) includes a period when the door is automatically opened as part of the air drying cycle, but this is included in the total wash time in the programme.
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Re: Mr. Grumpy rants again

Postby Lurker » 24 Sep 2021, 11:37

I don’t understand why the economy wash is so long either.
The thirty minute wash is nearly all we ever use.

Ours is fine except for the stupid design of the filter. I have to clean this out twice a week, as her majesty thinks our dishwasher is also a waste disposal unit :x :x
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Re: Mr. Grumpy rants again

Postby sunnybob » 24 Sep 2021, 12:20

novocaine wrote:our last machine was a bosch. It died after 10 years with a defective pump. ;)

I would expect at least 10 years and i would then be ok with it needing parts.

Andyp wrote:While waiting for the retailer to find you an english manual I am sure you can find one on the Bosch website


Bosch UK and USA deny the machine exists, but I've just found out Bosch has a big factory in spain, so I shall be surfing that later.

AJB Temple wrote:You may be judging the economy wash incorrectly. Some machines use long soak intervals, and very long air drying times, when next to no energy is used. Totally OK if you programme the machine to run overnight.

The economy mode on our machine (Miele) includes a period when the door is automatically opened as part of the air drying cycle, but this is included in the total wash time in the programme.


I dont expect to be using that setting often. The saving of using it in my electricity bill would be at best three decimal places of one percent :eusa-naughty:

Lurker wrote:I don’t understand why the economy wash is so long either.
The thirty minute wash is nearly all we ever use.

Ours is fine except for the stupid design of the filter. I have to clean this out twice a week, as her majesty thinks our dishwasher is also a waste disposal unit :x :x


We dont rinse plates as the books tell you to, but at least we scrape excess food into the bin before loading. I think you need to try harder to train 'er ladyship :eusa-doh:
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Re: Mr. Grumpy rants again

Postby AJB Temple » 24 Sep 2021, 12:24

There was a thing on Radio 4 recently saying that prerinsing is a bad idea. Dishwashers are programmed to detect dirt somehow (god knows how) and this is less effective if you pre-rinse, which they say also wastes water. We just scrape off. It's no big deal to clean the filter on our machine.
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Re: Mr. Grumpy rants again

Postby RogerM » 24 Sep 2021, 12:32

AJB Temple wrote:There was a thing on Radio 4 recently saying that prerinsing is a bad idea. Dishwashers are programmed to detect dirt somehow (god knows how) and this is less effective if you pre-rinse, which they say also wastes water. We just scrape off. It's no big deal to clean the filter on our machine.


We have a Miele which is about 14 years old and hasn't missed a beat. When loading, we just make sure there are no grains of rice or apple pips on the plates as they are the perfect size to jam the water outlets on the arms, and they're a bazzard to clear.
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Re: Mr. Grumpy rants again

Postby Just4fun » 24 Sep 2021, 13:01

sunnybob wrote:But, the rant goes on.... Inside are 30 page instruction manuals, in German, Spanish, Dutch, French, and Greek. Did you spot the glaring omission?
On asking the shop for an english manual the reply was "who uses english these days?"
To be fair, he did say he would look around for me. I a not holding my breath.

I have had the same problem with numerous products ranging from petty stuff bought at Lidl to the last 2 new cars I have bought. In all cases if I raise the issue the retailer will promise to try and get an English language manual but I have never known one actually do so.
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Re: Mr. Grumpy rants again

Postby sunnybob » 24 Sep 2021, 14:09

Rice and egg are completely immune to a dishwashers best efforts. A pan used for boiling rice will be cleaned, but if any are on a knife or ladle... uhuh.
I've just contacted Bosh service Cyprus, very efficient and helpful lady has promised to email me an english book. Time will tell.
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Re: Mr. Grumpy rants again

Postby AJB Temple » 24 Sep 2021, 15:57

With correct programme and detergents Bob, modern dishwashers will easily remove egg, rice etc. They have come on a long way.
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Re: Mr. Grumpy rants again

Postby sunnybob » 24 Sep 2021, 16:13

The last one was installed in 08, so theres bound to be improvements.
But I'm still waiting for a manual I can read to find out what those programs are.
The buttons are not self explanatory.
There is one labelled "speed + perfect set up 3 sec"
W.TF>?? :eusa-doh:
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Re: Mr. Grumpy rants again

Postby novocaine » 24 Sep 2021, 16:32

sunnybob wrote:The last one was installed in 08, so theres bound to be improvements.
But I'm still waiting for a manual I can read to find out what those programs are.
The buttons are not self explanatory.
There is one labelled "speed + perfect set up 3 sec"
W.TF>?? :eusa-doh:


what's the model code?
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Re: Mr. Grumpy rants again

Postby sunnybob » 24 Sep 2021, 16:48

BOSCH SMS4HTW33E 01
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Re: Mr. Grumpy rants again

Postby clogs » 24 Sep 2021, 17:01

Sunny Bob
our new dishwasher has just turned....almost 400€.....what a palaver to fit the kitchen door on...intergrated..
anyway it has a touch screen sort of ....to get the thing running...
like ur's the pictures mean nothing.....even the start (can I say button) looks like a Martian wrote it.....

I want to know whats wrong with a turnable knob for the wash cycle I need and an OFF button....

oh, this machine has an electric valve attached to the inlet pipe....blxxdy huge thing...so it now needs a bigger hole to get it thru to the water supply under the sink.....
BOOK says it's an anti flooding device....."B" marvelous.....
if I get more than 5 years out of it I'll be surprised....
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Re: Mr. Grumpy rants again

Postby Guineafowl21 » 24 Sep 2021, 18:26

Our new Bosch dishwasher gave a silly pump fault soon after purchase - solution was to turn off, tilt the machine 45* left, wait for a bit, then tilt 45* right, wait, and switch on again.

Once we sorted the drain the problem never recurred.

I might split the crowd here, but we give our dirty plates to the dog to pre-clean. Never get clogged nozzles, filters or hoses.
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