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Running appliances overnight

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Re: Running appliances overnight

Postby Tiresias » 08 Dec 2021, 12:58

I must plead guilty to running my electric storage heaters overnight.

Well, I like to live life on the edge. Ice cubes down the vest of fear and all that.
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Re: Running appliances overnight

Postby Woodster » 08 Dec 2021, 14:56

RogerS wrote:
Woodster wrote:Apologies, I was incorrect. It’s actually 300 fires a week, not a year. The biggest culprit being washing machines.

https://www.diyweek.net/nearly-300-hous ... appliances


Why don't you actually read what any article says before jumping in with whatever particular hobby-horse you're riding at the moment?

This is what the article says ..NOT washing machines.

The biggest cause of domestic appliance fires remain cookers (incl. ovens). More than 8,000 blazes were started by a cooker. That’s over half (53%) of all domestic appliance fires tackled by the fire services. Toasters were the third highest cause of dwelling appliance fires, with 1,368 blazes started by a faulty toaster. Microwave ovens were the cause of 922 fires during 2019/20.




You also omit to consider just how many domestic appliances there are in the country and so what the percentage of fires is relative to the installed base. You also neglect to reference that the article has been written by a company keen to sell you domestic appliance insurance.


Calm down. I posted a different link to the one I’d seen earlier. It had a graphic that showed washing machines at the top of the list for domestic appliance fires. It obviously didn’t include fires etc as a domestic appliance.

Edit: This was the graphic.

Image


If saving a few pennies by washing clothes at night is your thing why would it bother me? I’m just trying to say it may not be worth the risk.
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Re: Running appliances overnight

Postby RogerS » 08 Dec 2021, 15:48

Woodster, please stop wriggling and have the grace to accept that your original post was misleading.

You made statement A with a link immediately below. Rational people would assume that the link was there to support the assertion in Statement A. If you'd bothered to read the link that you posted then you would have realised that statement A was wrong.

Your graphic in the above post is meaningless without the source defined so that we can make an informed view as to the accuracy and provenance.
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Re: Running appliances overnight

Postby Sheffield Tony » 08 Dec 2021, 16:50

Before getting too worried ...

The chart above. I doubt many people use the cooker overnight, and everyone pretty much leaves the fridge on. So looking at the top risks which are optional - washing machine, tumble drier, dishwasher. That totals 2817 fires in the 2 year period, so 1407.5 per year. The UK has about 28M households, so about 0.005% of them have a fire caused by one of those appliances in a year. 0r 0.4% in 80 years.

Some of those fires would of course have happened during the day, being around doesn't guarantee you can deal with it, a fire doesn't need to be that big to be beyond domestic extinguishers.
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Re: Running appliances overnight

Postby AJB Temple » 08 Dec 2021, 19:00

The chart Woodster posted above is from the 2018 Which report. I posted a link to the actual report in my prior post.

I suspect that the vast majority of cooker fires (as others have said) are caused by allowing the build up of dirt and grease both in and around the appliance, coupled with operator error (boiling chip fat etc).
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Re: Running appliances overnight

Postby RogerS » 08 Dec 2021, 19:40

AJB Temple wrote:The chart Woodster posted above is from the 2018 Which report. I posted a link to the actual report in my prior post.

....


Which is interesting as that means that the order has changed quite dramatically in two years.

EDIT: Just found the figures for 2019 which feature cooking appliances right at the top. As does the 2020 report mentioned above.

TBH I'm thinking that those Which figures are looking questionable unless 2018 was the year of dodgy washing machines.
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Re: Running appliances overnight

Postby AJB Temple » 08 Dec 2021, 19:56

From a little bit of reading around, whilst appliances that cause fires vary, there may be a correlation between problems and "lower cost" brands. I also wonder to what extent poor installation and less than ideal house wiring safety play their part. Some manufactures do seem a tad accident prone.
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Re: Running appliances overnight

Postby Andy Kev. » 09 Dec 2021, 09:07

I'm relieved to see that computers are low down on that chart because I'm in the habit of leaving mine on sleep/standby overnight. Would it be more advisable to simply switch it off? It would hardly be an inconvenience as they only take a short while to kick off again.
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Re: Running appliances overnight

Postby Andyp » 09 Dec 2021, 09:31

FWIW my iMac only gets switchd off when either we are on holiday or we get a power cut.
Have it in my mind that the power board circuitry is more likely to expire before anything else.
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Re: Running appliances overnight

Postby RogerS » 09 Dec 2021, 09:35

Andyp wrote:FWIW my iMac only gets switchd off when either we are on holiday or we get a power cut.
Have it in my mind that the power board circuitry is more likely to expire before anything else.


Absolutely. My understanding is that the main stress on electronics is when they are switched on (and off).
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Re: Running appliances overnight

Postby Peri » 09 Dec 2021, 11:05

Mike G wrote:Modern appliances universally seem to bleep loudly when they've finished their cycles, so I don't know how you guys manage to run them overnight. A bleeping washing machine at 2 in the morning would drive me nuts.


It's amazing what you get used to. My wife loves her tech - smart TV's in every room, God knows how many tablets, phones and iPads, smart speakers blah blah blah.

She recently bought one of those video doorbell things that's linked to all her other tech. Every time someone walks past the front door we get a variety of bings, bongs, rumbles and vibrations. That'd be great if we lived at the end of a quiet cul-de-sac. Unfortunately we live on the ground floor of a 3 storey building, each floor having 3 flats...... and yes, anyone coming into the building has to walk past our door.

Noise drove me mad for about 2 weeks - now I don't notice it.


On topic, the only thing the Mrs wont run unattended is the tumble drier, everything else is fair game.

EDIT: I did see quite a noticeable reduction in our energy bills when we started turning off the 2 high-end desk top PC's we have here at night. For years they were on 24/7, but the last 5 years or so they only get switched on when we're in front of them.
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Re: Running appliances overnight

Postby RogerS » 09 Dec 2021, 12:02

Peri wrote:....
Noise drove me mad for about 2 weeks - now I don't notice it.
.....


You are absolutely right on that score. I just wish all manufacturers gave the option to disable these.. Looked in the manuals for ours, no chance. Or even alter the number of 'bings'. For instance, our small microwave announces the end of the cycle with five bings. Fair enough, we open the door within one bing. Now you'd think the s/w designers would realise this and stop binging. Nope. So now I'll wait as usually I'm only defrosting some bread ...30 secs. At 29 secs I hit Stop and just get one bing. Hah....that'll learn 'em.

Or cars...our Audi has that daft switch the engine off if you're stopped at traffic lights gizmo. You can disable it. You'd think they'd remember it? No, resets on igniiton off
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Re: Running appliances overnight

Postby Phil Pascoe » 09 Dec 2021, 12:36

My wheelchair beeps when reversing, which can be disabled. It beeps twice loudly when switched on, which cannot be disabled. Great, in the middle of the night.

My young nephew (who's mother was a ............ well, best not go there ....) heard the microwave ping at my m.i.l.s house one afternoon and quite innocently looked up and said dinner's ready, grandma. :lol:
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Re: Running appliances overnight

Postby Sheffield Tony » 09 Dec 2021, 15:05

Peri wrote:EDIT: I did see quite a noticeable reduction in our energy bills when we started turning off the 2 high-end desk top PC's we have here at night. For years they were on 24/7, but the last 5 years or so they only get switched on when we're in front of them.


It is probably true that power on is one of the bigger stresses on many electronic designs. But so much of modern consumer electronics (like computers, phones and laptops) are discarded long before anything fails, because of obsolescence, fashion etc.

Do remember that all this kit is consuming power when on, and contributing to CO2 emissions. And increasing our dependency on imported energy / fuels.
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Re: Running appliances overnight

Postby RogerS » 09 Dec 2021, 15:47

Sheffield Tony wrote:
Peri wrote:EDIT: I did see quite a noticeable reduction in our energy bills when we started turning off the 2 high-end desk top PC's we have here at night. For years they were on 24/7, but the last 5 years or so they only get switched on when we're in front of them.


It is probably true that power on is one of the bigger stresses on many electronic designs. But so much of modern consumer electronics (like computers, phones and laptops) are discarded long before anything fails, because of obsolescence, fashion etc.
...


I prefer to minimise the risk. It's fine to say switch off and if it fails go buy a new one but (a) that only works if you're still earning and have a disposable income and/or have a very flush pension and (b) assumes that your new device has consumed zero energy in its production and as a result generated zero CO2.
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Re: Running appliances overnight

Postby Sheffield Tony » 09 Dec 2021, 17:20

Well, I do see that argument. I generally keep old stuff going as long as I can because I suspect the environmental cost of the waste and manufacture outweighs improvements in efficiency often.

But on the flip side - how much electronics is thrown away because it failed (beyond repair), rather than because it no longer meets the user's needs (or wants, more likely). Phones, tablets, computers are usually not kept long enough to fail I suspect.

And I certainly would not leave any kit with lithium batteries plugged in in my absence. But then, we don't use the laundry machines overnight either.
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Re: Running appliances overnight

Postby RogerS » 09 Dec 2021, 17:51

Sheffield Tony wrote:...
But on the flip side - how much electronics is thrown away because it failed (beyond repair), rather than because it no longer meets the user's needs (or wants, more likely). Phones, tablets, computers are usually not kept long enough to fail I suspect.


Define 'long' ? I think it depends on the product.

Sheffield Tony wrote:...
And I certainly would not leave any kit with lithium batteries plugged in in my absence. But then, we don't use the laundry machines overnight either.


They don't have to be plugged into anything, Tony, to explode/overheat/catch fire. See here and look for 'cargo' instances.

https://www.faa.gov/hazmat/resources/li ... _chart.pdf
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Re: Running appliances overnight

Postby Andyp » 09 Dec 2021, 17:59

I think what we are all learning from this, in case we did not already know, is that it is imperative to have an adequate quantity of smoke alarms, well positioned, in the house and have them checked frequently.

If only missus would stop using one of ours as an egg timer. :)
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Re: Running appliances overnight

Postby 9fingers » 09 Dec 2021, 23:25

I thought kitchen smoke alarms were to tell everyone in the house that dinner was ready?

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Re: Running appliances overnight

Postby Woodster » 09 Dec 2021, 23:55

Any statistics on the subject of domestic appliance fires is to me just an indication of the possibility, and should be an example of how daft it is to run equipment like this whilst you’re asleep. I’ll say no more as it seems saving a few pennies is more important to some folks and you’re obviously free to do as you please. If the discussion has persuaded just one of you not to do it then that’s probably a good thing.
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Re: Running appliances overnight

Postby Phil Pascoe » 09 Dec 2021, 23:59

Have you consulted anyone about your paranoia? :lol:
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Re: Running appliances overnight

Postby Woodster » 10 Dec 2021, 00:46

Phil Pascoe wrote:Have you consulted anyone about your paranoia? :lol:


You may think acting the fool is funny Phil but I’ve seen the result of a washing machine fire after the fire brigade put it out and there’s nothing funny about it.
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Re: Running appliances overnight

Postby Phil Pascoe » 10 Dec 2021, 08:31

A washing machine. Out of how many million washing machines?
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Re: Running appliances overnight

Postby AJB Temple » 10 Dec 2021, 10:18

I agree with Phil on this. It is easy to extrapolate from a few incidents and create an overblown risk. If your house has modern wiring with a recent test from someone qualified and not wearing a cowboy hat, and if you have bought a good quality new appliance, and if you install and maintain it properly, then the risk is between minuscule and vanishingly low. Ministry of Housing statistics in 2017 show that there were 23.9 million dwellings in the UK then. More now I expect.

I feel totally fine with running appliances overnight or when we are out. Would not have done when we moved in 5 years ago as the wiring had been "improved" by a complete idiot (who was, unbelievably, a doctor) on a DIY basis. It has been de-cowboyed since.
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Re: Running appliances overnight

Postby Stuart » 10 Dec 2021, 15:54

My aversion to overnighting appliances is deep rooted from many years ago when perhaps appliances weren’t as ‘robust’ electrically as they are now and we had 3 small kids. I now see little point in changing and there’s no benefit to me (us) in changing apart from a disturbed nights sleep. I’m not bothered about running the washing machine or tumble drier when we’re out because there’s no direct risk to us.

I always find other peoples attitude to risk very interesting (it was part of my job for many years) as illustrated here with a real swing in opinions.
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