• Hi all and welcome to TheWoodHaven2 brought into the 21st Century, kicking and screaming! We all have Alasdair to thank for the vast bulk of the heavy lifting to get us here, no more so than me because he's taken away a huge burden of responsibility from my shoulders and brought us to this new shiny home, with all your previous content (hopefully) still intact! Please peruse and feed back. There is still plenty to do, like changing the colour scheme, adding the banner graphic, tweaking the odd setting here and there so I have added a new thread in the 'Technical Issues, Bugs and Feature Requests' forum for you to add any issues you find, any missing settings or just anything you'd like to see added/removed from the feature set that Xenforo offers. We will get to everything over the coming weeks so please be patient, but add anything at all to the thread I mention above and we promise to get to them over the next few days/weeks/months. In the meantime, please enjoy!

A VERY long term project - Finally finished !

StevieB":1wqqtbep said:
Impressive! Have you got a steel plate between those beams or just 2 pieces of timber? I had thought from the earlier photos that it was a single beam, but from the last photo it doesn't look that way - any sag at all?

The two beams are bolted together in five places with 16mm steel bolts and wooden spacers to maintain the overall width I wanted. As for sag - nothing visible, but as this house is upside down (living space on the first floor and bedrooms below) there is nothing above except joists supporting the attic floor, so I doubt I'd notice.
 
Mike G":2bnfe276 said:
I see you are using pressed metal profiles for your stud walls, as is common on the continent. Spaniards who visit us here look really confused when I tell them our walls are made of wood.

Yes, and the great advantage when fitting a dry lining in an old building like this is that the galvanised profiles are very resistant to damp - the previous dry liner in this house pre-dated the steel profiles and the wood frames had rotted (fortunately not dry rot).
 
I've always thought those galvanised profiles were a good idea.
They are heavily used here for office partitioning but I've rarely seen them used for housing here or even being promoted at building exhibitions. I sometimes think that the UK building trade is very change resistant unless forced to adpart to meet building regs.

Bob
 
...and they are soooo quick to install because the rails and uprights interlock, no awkward skew nailing of butt joints. You can clip the uprights into the top and bottom rails without finally fixing them, then any small misalignment with the plasterboard sheets due to sloping floors etc, can be corrected by sliding the uprights to fit as you attach the plasterboard. They also have pre-punched holes for passing conduits through and the channel profile holds the insulation until you fit the plasterboard. Brilliant !
 
Yeah that, and the conduit thing. We wire our buildings very differently from those on the continent, and don't use much if any conduit at domestic level. Conduit would be necessary with the pressed metal studwork.
 
We split one very large bedroom into two when we moved here and those metal frames were used. I am still loathed to hang anything heavy on the plasterboard. I am aware of Molly and other plasterboard fixings but give be a solid wood stud any day.
 
Fitted the glass yesterday. The weather forecast was for rain and high winds, not too worried about the rain on its own, but my stapled on poly would not stay put long in high winds.

In the event it was nothing much, but at least it's raining - first significant rain since june. :D :D
 
Mike G":36m9rfmw said:
Yeah that, and the conduit thing. We wire our buildings very differently from those on the continent, and don't use much if any conduit at domestic level. Conduit would be necessary with the pressed metal studwork.

Put like that the conduit sounds daunting, but it's actually flexible plastic tube, prewired with 3x1.5mm2 or 3x2.5mm2 single strands. You feed it though the studs off a reel just like you would with UK flat twin and earth - plus you can always pull an extra wire or two in where needed. Around 40c/m for the 2.5.
 
The back of the ground floor is below the level of the garden in this little house - it's built into a hill. There are some concerns with damp - more than that - with water getting in so I've taken lots of measures to ensure good drainage above in the garden close to the house. Now, just for belt and braces, I'm creating a "cellar" area at the back where the old staircase was which will be separated from the downstairs living areas by an insulated partition wall.

In the cellar will be some rough storage and things like the gas cylinder for the cooker, the hot water cylinder etc. I've dug down though the centuries of accumulated rubbish under the old floor (joists laid straight onto the soil would you believe !!!) and found bed rock about 30cm down. The house walls are built directly onto the rock, quite reassuring really !

However - I could picture water arriving via the sub soil onto the bed rock, then seeping/flowing along the sloping surface of the rock under the rest of the house, sooooo, I've spent a day drilling, chiselling etc to create a sump in the rock and a series of channels to direct water to it and plan to fit a float actuated pump to get rid of any accumulation of water. Above will be hardcore for drainage then a concrete floor.

The pumps I could find in the big sheds here are for wells and need at least 30cm of water to function - not suitable - then I thought about my boat in the UK, that had a little 12v electric bilge pump with a float switch and cleared all but 15mm or so of water in the bilge. Found a super one on line plus a mains to 12v DC power supply to run it, all for less than 35€. It's just arrived. Installation tomorrow.
 
chataigner":q823usbx said:
Mike G":q823usbx said:
Yeah that, and the conduit thing. We wire our buildings very differently from those on the continent, and don't use much if any conduit at domestic level. Conduit would be necessary with the pressed metal studwork.

Put like that the conduit sounds daunting, but it's actually flexible plastic tube, prewired with 3x1.5mm2 or 3x2.5mm2 single strands. You feed it though the studs off a reel just like you would with UK flat twin and earth - plus you can always pull an extra wire or two in where needed. Around 40c/m for the 2.5.

Interesting. In Spain, the conduit is fitted empty.
 
Not a huge amount of progress that's easily photographed, though quite a bit going on - insulation etc. and the electrical distribution board fitted and connected on my side at least. The most visible part is some kitchen cupboard doors, wood frame plus mdf panel, built in the workshop and fitted (mostly) today. I say mostly cos one was 2cm too short. All the others are under drawers, so it's the only full height one and somehow I'd got it wrong. :oops: :oops: :oops:

Will the site software pick up the word Merde I wonder ?

Photos when it's replaced - happily I have enough material left over....
 
" using pressed metal profiles for your stud walls, as is common on the continent"

Don't have to go that far Mike. My two Nephews-in-Law have used them extensively in Dublin for 15 - 20 years as large mill buildings etc become subdivided into apartments. They aim to completely 'board out' a conventional 3 bedroom house shell in a day. Laser level, metal framing, screw guns.

Sam
 
there are quite a few houses in parts of Norfolk on new estates that use the metal studding. I know coz I delivered it to the sites. I think normal t&e just gets used with metal studwork here ie no conduit
 
Nearly two weeks of continuous rain or drizzle has put a stop to progress on the dry liner and stud walls downstairs because I ran out of plasterboard a few days ago and cant fetch more with an open trailer in the wet.
So... I've built and fitted the kitchen cupboard doors and drawers. Simple cope/stick joinery and mdf panels. I wanted real tree wood wooden doors so that they could easily be touched up in case of damage because once the pretty melamine or lacquer jobs are chipped there's not a lot you can do (the house will be rented out).

dk-20191124-0146-kitchen-cupboard-doors.JPG


First coat of lasure has come up horribly orange (it says med oak on the tin) looks like I'll need to find a better colour. MDF will be painted to match other things in the kitchen when we decide on colour schemes.

Oh yes, and I've also fitted and wired the new electrical distribution board.
 
chataigner":2exnmn62 said:
....
Oh yes, and I've also fitted and wired the new electrical distribution board.

Oh, I'm so jealous that you're still allowed to that over there. I sympathise with the weather. I wish I had a covered walkway from the workshop to the house :(
 
RogerS":3uo540x3 said:
chataigner":3uo540x3 said:
....
Oh yes, and I've also fitted and wired the new electrical distribution board.

Oh, I'm so jealous that you're still allowed to that over there.

JFDI Roger and if any jobsworth want paperwork get a spark to sign it off.

I don't bother with signing off electrical work but for gas I do all the labouring and get a gas safe man to commission it and make the final gas connection ie tighten up a 22mm compression coupler on the incoming pipe. Last time he ran all the boiler diagnostics and signed off the job for £80 inc vat which gave me 5yrs warranty on the boiler and registartion with the local authority.

There is a muttering about rental properties having to have a regular electrical inspection (Gas safety inspection is already mandatory each year in England). I'm thinking of doing a training course, getting some test equipment and doing it myself.

Bob
 
9fingers":cdeemn7a said:
RogerS":cdeemn7a said:
chataigner":cdeemn7a said:
....
Oh yes, and I've also fitted and wired the new electrical distribution board.

Oh, I'm so jealous that you're still allowed to that over there.

JFDI Roger and if any jobsworth want paperwork get a spark to sign it off.

I don't bother with signing off electrical work but for gas I do all the labouring and get a gas safe man to commission it and make the final gas connection ie tighten up a 22mm compression coupler on the incoming pipe. Last time he ran all the boiler diagnostics and signed off the job for £80 inc vat which gave me 5yrs warranty on the boiler and registartion with the local authority.

There is a muttering about rental properties having to have a regular electrical inspection (Gas safety inspection is already mandatory each year in England). I'm thinking of doing a training course, getting some test equipment and doing it myself.

Bob
Agtree..when you need a job done right..do it yourself
 
JFDI Roger and if any jobsworth want paperwork get a spark to sign it off.

Agreed. And, that is being kind to the average "jobsworth"...I find a long, steady, unthreatening, but unwavering, look and the word "Really?" in a LONG drawl can yield surprising results. As does a prolonged silent stare....Me? scary? Brouhahahahaha....210lbs of fighting fat, I'm just a big cuddly....

Sam
 
The next window - ground floor street frontage - takes shape.
Had a rush of blood to the head and bought the oak to make the last two windows and the new front door. The first of the windows is now taking shape in the workshop.

Here is the fixed part of the frame and the first bits of the opening lights - the second part of one of the opening lights can be seen in glue up on the bench. The gaps around the opening lights always look frightening at this stage, but I use the AQ21 wiping seals and they need an absolute min of 4mm, 7.5mm max, so I go for 5-6mm. With three seals in the width, that comes to quite a big gap !

dk-20191231-0813-window.JPG


Hope to be ready to install it next week, but finish takes a while, especially with slow drying in cold weather.
 
Oh dear, it's been a year since I posted an update on this. Quite a lot has been done though.

Kitchen corner almost there, one bedroom more or less decorated, false ceilings and insulation fitted throughout, new front door made and fitted, bathroom ready for tiling, etc, etc.

dk-20201201-3884-9%20rue%2011%20nov.jpg


dk-20201201-3883-9%20rue%2011%20nov.jpg


dk-20201201-3880-9%20rue%2011%20nov.jpg


The last window is nearly finished in the workshop and will be installed before Xmas.

dk-20201203-3896-m%20and%20t%20joints.jpg
 
At last an update - my wounded ankle requires a bit of rest, so unable to press on with the work, I'm seated at my desk updating this thread. Despite lots of good intentions, I just dont seem to get around to posting very often on this project, but progress has been made, in fact I'm quite close to finishing it. With a bit of luck it should be all done before Xmas and I can start looking for a tenant.

The two big jobs since last posting were the roof and the exterior cladding/insulation. I got professionals in for the roof and they did a lovely job. It was a relatively new outfit that had done a few high profile jobs in the area recently and had had quite a bit of coverage in the local media - so I asked them (along with two other firms) to quote. All three were within a few % of each other on price, but it was terms and conditions that swung it. One wanted 50% up front with no guarantee of completion date, one gave a vague idea of doing it within a year and the one I chose gave a clear date (3 months), but also asked for 25% up front (at signature). To test their resolve I asked for a 10% penalty in the event of more than 1 month overrun and offered just 10% up front. They agreed.

In the event they arrived on the day agreed, worked fast and well and finished in just over a week. I was really impressed by the people, everyone seemed to be highly motivated and worked as a team with no sense of hierarchy. I was interested to find out how they were organised and discovered that all the men in the company are shareholders and they elect their MD for a fixed term of 2 years, then a new election. Salaries are voted and everyone has a profit share. Seems to work !

Anyhow - here is the before :

toit_1.jpg


and here the after :

dk-20210316-4427-toit.jpg


Following that I found the time to fit the exterior insulation and cladding :

dk-20210610-5310-9-11%20isolation.jpg


The insulation and membrane were a terrible job - I wanted to be sure I didnt get the insulation wet, so picked a really fine week in mid summer, but working on a south facing wall in the full sun at 38°C was not much fun. I also discovered that you cant lead a ladder against the insulation or the membrane while working on it and had to come up with some innovative solutions... Glad the elf and safety people couldn't see me.

dk-20210610-5312-9-11%20isolation.jpg


dk-20211018-8208-9-11%20progress.jpg


Notice two fixed lights just under the roof line, these light the attic.

Inside much has been done, the kitchen now has a gas hob and a cooker hood :

dk-20211018-8209-9-11%20progress.jpg


The shower room has a toilet, a shower and a vanity unit :

dk-20211018-8210-9-11%20progress.jpg


dk-20211018-8211-9-11%20progress.jpg


dk-20211018-8212-9-11%20progress.jpg


and the space under the stairs has been turned into a laundry/utility room :

dk-20211018-8213-9-11%20progress.jpg


Because the garden of little house backs onto the garden of my main house, I hadnt got the electricity connected (no point in paying the standing charge), I worked with an extension lead. As completion approached it was time to make the jump to connection to the supply, but as I'd done the wiring and consumer unit myself I was a tad apprehensive about awkward questions. It all turned out well - the chaps who came to connect the supply and change the meter etc seemed perfectly happy and everything works fine.

Next week (ankle permitting) I lay the flooring in the living room and remove the protective mdf from the stairs and stain/varnish the wood. Then it will be time to contact a few agents to see what guarantees they can offer regarding non-payment - difficult tenants etc before deciding whether to use an agent or handle it myself.
 
Excellent progress David!

I did the tax affairs for a friend a few years back and was horrified by the way agents handled his rental. They took in the region of 10% and for that just passed the details their favoured plumber/spark/builder to the tenant and it was like a blank cheque. they also continued to take their fee and pay out "rent" to the landlord when the tenant stopped paying rent!

We let 6 properties through the family company and manage them ourselves. We are also local but not quite as local as you so can fix stuff quickly.
I look very deeply into the tenants finances including their credit reports and last 3 months of bank statements. I make sure that the rents can be afforded leaving sufficient disposable income for a decent standard of living. Without this there is the potential time bomb ticking for later. I ask for landlords and employers references. There is high demand for rentals in UK so I can afford to be choosy. Recently I have been getting around 20 applications for each flat. At least half are chancers and a'holes, another few "no show" for viewings. Legally we can't charge extra damage deposits for pets so in common with many UK landlords, I'm reluctant to allow pets which is a shame but they can do costly damage and cause nuisance to fellow tenants.

References can tell you a lot. I had one recently where one partner was clearly a regular gambler from his bank statements and only a casual worker. The other partner had a good job, did all the negotiating and was great to deal with.She was pregnant and had been refused by other landlord and agencies which I felt was grossly unfair. I asked for a guarantor for the rental payment from her father which was readily agreed to.

We collect all rents by direct debit which in UK means that as soon as a tenant makes any changes through their bank, I'm informed by email that day or the next. In contrast, payment by standing order means that it is not until after the due date that you know that anything is amiss. DD charges have just gone up but still worth it to me at £9.60 per month per tenant.
Loss of rental income here can be covered by the landlords insurance policy but we don't take up that option.
We can get pro-forma tenancy agreements free online which are kept up to date with the latest law.

Obviously things may be different in France legally and how much info you can ask for.

Good luck
Bob
 
Floors are now laid, the stairs have been cleaned up and treated with a 3 coats of a non-slip varnish stain. Fearsomely expensive, but I'm delighted with the appearance and it seems very tough. Time will tell.

As soon as Xmas is over, I will install the fence panels to divide the little garden from our main garden and then it's contact some agents to see what they can offer - though I'm leaning towards handling it myself - I'm retired, so why not use my time instead of money.
 
Today was the culmination of quite a few years spent on this project - the first tenants moved in this morning.

I see looking back on the first few posts that I said "not less than 2 years", well it was not less than 2 years, it was around 6 ! :o :o To be fair to myself I have only worked on it when I felt like it, sometimes weeks went by without me touching it and I never did more than about 1-2 days per week at most.

Time will tell what long term expenses I will have but the rental I am getting equates to around 12% of the investment in actual cash. My labour over several years is of course not included in the calculation...

For the next 12m I will try to avoid taking on anything major, there are 1001 minor jobs needing attention and the garden is a bit neglected, not to mention still being president of our local photo club and vice president of the local equestrian society. So time to take a breather and to catch up !
 
Well done David. You must be relieved it's all done.
 
I’ve had to go back up the thread to remind myself of how good a job you have done.

Well done for sticking with it. A great job and quite an asset for years to come.
 
Did the agent give you a property valuation after all your work? Just thinking that might give you a better idea of value to base your returns on rather than cash spent over a few years

I suspect 12% return might be a tad optimistic from a business point of view
I reckon on about 6% for the local market round here before any extra ordinary items and maintenance which possibly brings it nearer to 4% plus any capital gain of course.

Good luck with your tenants
Bob
 
I'm sure you are right Bob, the 12% is calculated on the rental I'm actually getting and the money I've spent. If I add in my labour the figure of course is much lower. Around 7-8% I think is more realistic (based on a guestimate valuation) rather than on costs, and that still does not include operating expenses such as minor repairs, building insurance etc. For those only time will tell. :eusa-think: :eusa-think:

Either way it beats the rate of return on a savings account !! :obscene-drinkingcheers:
 
Indeed, these things seem to go in waves. Since Christmas, across 4 properties I've had to replace a washing machine, oven element, an electric shower and two fences but that is the first significant expenditure in the last 15 months.
At least I'm not doing BTL and needing the income to pay the mortgage.

Bob
 
Back
Top