New Garden Table Design

[Robert]

So my winter project is going to be a new garden table.

Some flooring came up on ebay not too far from me and i picked up 12sq m plus for £70. Seller didn't know what wood it was and the pictures looked like it might be iroko or similar.

I'm currently recovering from twinging by back when I collected it. It is heavy stuff. back problem in my case comes from repetition of picking up rather than too much weight at once but the wood was definitely heavy.

I weighed a plank and measured it to calculate the density - 850kg/m3.

My best guess based on the density, hardness (it is tough stuff) and appearance is Afzelia. A wood I've never heard of but reported uses are flooring and boat decks.

As it came up top and planed and freshly cut below.
One site says it smells like leather when cut but to me it smelled similar to Oak. So may be something else.

Seller said it came from an Italian flooring place 15 years ago. Logo and brand on the back is a Chinese company so I'm thinking it could be from anywhere if china is involved.

Best guess anyone? in any case i think it will be OK outdoors.

So on to the table...

All I want to ask about for now is the best way to join things together.

This is the old table I made 10 years ago. it might make another season or 2 but it is on its way out.

The slats were always going to fail first so they are clamped in but replaceable. I have changed some over the years.

The slats do like to warp so there are added braces underneath to hold them flat and aligned

The main top frame is glued M+T at the middle and corners. it is twisting and rotting at the thin areas where the slats ends are clamped underneath.

The idea with the design was to let the rain pass through. Thing is the areas where it is just glued together with no gaps and no drainage are the places in the best condition!

So how do I design the new one? Rain must pass through the top to prevent puddling but do i try and make joins that can drain or just glue everything?

The new table design I am playing with is similar size to the old one (1700x1000) but can extend into a 1700 round table via removable crescent 'wings'...maybe. long way off yet.

 

[AndyP]

Do you have to slavishly copy the original? In our northern climes I question the benefit of a central hole for the parasol. The sun comes in underneath surely. Remove the central piece with the hole in it and reduce the the possible jointing by half.

 

[Robert]

It's going to be nothing like the original really. I'm asking more about how to construct than design at this stage. Solid glued joints everywhere or some kind of ventilated join with water drainage sort of thing.

And it will still have a hole and a Lazy Susan

 

[DaveL]

That wood does look like iroko, I have used to make garden chairs and a table. They live in the shed when not in uses the need to shed rain was not part of my design.
The table was posted here about 2 years ago and the chairs where on UKW, probably 10 or more years ago, Alf was still posting then as she did comment on them.

 

[StevieB]

Cannot help with the design question, but +1 for Iroko

 

[Woodbloke]

Cannot help with the design question, but +1 for Iroko

+2 for Iroko (beware of the dust; nasty stuff) - Rob

 

[Robert]

Problem with iroko though is the weight. This stuff is really heavy.

Iroko is 660kg/m3 and this wood is 850.

Here is a page about Afzelia https://www.trada.co.uk/wood-species/afzelia/ and it says 830kg/m3

I planed one board, sanded it and took a few hand plane shavings off the edge to smell and i didn't sneeze . Never used iroko so don't know how much it takes to give you allergy reactions.

The shedding rain thing is summer only as it will be under a tarp for the winter - same as the old table.

First ideas for the table top...

2 pieces at 80mm wide looks too heavy and no planking drawn but it shows the idea.

 

[MattS]

When I use iroko it makes my nose feel very funny so I keep the mask on at all times.

Looks like the areas where it has rotted are where it's a very thin gap. The water bridges gap between both pieces, and then it has support underneath as well to hold it there. I think with larger spaces between boards and a different construction which removes the under piece things would be improved.

 

[DaveL]

Be careful of trying to get a reaction to the wood, I don't have a problem with it but know of people who worked with it OK, then suddenly had really bad reaction, A&E treatment needed.

 

[Woodbloke]

Iroko is 660kg/m3 and this wood is 850.

Here is a page about Afzelia https://www.trada.co.uk/wood-species/afzelia/ and it says 830kg/m3

I planed one board, sanded it and took a few hand plane shavings off the edge to smell and i didn't sneeze . Never used iroko so don't know how much it takes to give you allergy reactions.

Having read the page, it would appear to be Afzelia, so similar in appearance to Iroko but a lot heavier. If you ever use Iroko, it gives off a very peppery dust which is intensely irritating in one's hooter and can cause some users a lot of extreme unpleasantness. It doesn't affect me unduly, but I'm very wary about using it; better safe than sorry - Rob

 

[Robert]

Making curves using straight boards is going to involve a lot of end to end joining.

Is it worth getting a finger glue router cutter or just tongue and groove the ends together? And if finger router cutters are worth investing in what style as there appear to be a couple of variations.

The curved frames will be 2 boards thick so I can stagger the butt join positions so ultimate strength isn't the issue, more a case of which is easier to do.

thanks.

 

[Woodbloke]

Making curves using straight boards is going to involve a lot of end to end joining.

Provided you know where the curves are going to go, I'd use a Domino for end to end jointing - Rob

 

[Robert]

While I wait for a planer thicknesser that can actually cut this stuff I've been doing battle with fusion 360 again. One minute I know what I'm doing and making good progress and the next I'm struggling to do basic things like move a table leg where I want it

Anyway the idea so far...

Without extensions added

And with

Ignore the non equal legs I'll sort them out eventually.

Not sure how I support the extensions yet, Thinking maybe tongue and groove on the mating edge and a batten of some kind underneath.

As drawn all the planking stops 3mm short of the curved frames all round. The frames being 30mm thick and the planks 15mm the idea is to join the planks to each other underneath with battens then hold the assembly to the frames with stainless brackets underneath. So no joinery except for putting the frames together.

That's if it works when I get to try it of course.

 

[AndyP]

Looks grand Robert.
Have you decided on how to do the joints with reference to the water ingress highlighted in your OP?

 

[Robert]

Looks grand Robert.
Have you decided on how to do the joints with reference to the water ingress highlighted in your OP?

That was the last paragraph above

There are no joints except on the outer framework. The table surface planks 'float' on brackets and don't touch the framework.

 

[AndyP]

Jeez, how did I miss that

In my defence it was before café o'clock