Veneered wall art

[Stuart]

I’ve been asked to make a fairly large (1700 x 1000 mm ish) coloured veneer ‘wall art’. Given the chosen design and size I’m well outside my comfort zone but actually quite enthusiastic about doing it.

I’ve got quite a lot of small scale veneering under my belt now and never had a significant issue but with this the prospect of warping is currently at the forefront of my mind. Clearly I don’t want to do what’s going to be a huge amount of work only to see it gently curl into oblivion so the choice of substrate is important.

9mm ply is my first choice (it will be lipped) as I’ve always found it to be stable and hasn’t needed a balancer. However, this has all been small scale and the ply has been ‘secured’ from movement by being glued to other things (e.g. box sides etc.). The other saving grace is the veneer won’t all be glued at once but in smaller sections, no more than about 300 square mm at a time with an allowance for drying (titebond is the glue of choice).

Can anyone see any major issues with what I’ve outlined?

Thanks

 

[Steve Maskery]

Veneer both sides. This is not small-scale veneering and the forces will be significant.

How long do you think it will take you? I'm thinking that for quite extended periods of time the board will be partially veneered, so there will be different tension forces in different areas of the board.

The biggest veneering I've ever done was a pair of 2.1m wardrobe doors, but that was full leaves, not any sort of marquetry.
S

 

[Stuart]

Thanks Steve. Not what I was hoping to hear, thought that using ply would mean forces wouldn’t be such a problem.

A guess is it’ll take a couple of weeks minimum, possibly longer. Your assumption of partial veneering is quite correct.

At what point would you veneer the back? First thing or later in the process?

 

[Steve Maskery]

I know it's a big area, but can you stitch together the various shapes into one big picture and then lay it as one?
I'm by no means an expert on this, I've done it a few times (including once when I ended up taking £200 quids-worth of veneer to the tip) and I know it is not easy.
S

 

[Stuart]

Thank you again Steve, I appreciate comments from someone who’s been there, done that!

Stitching is a nightmare with about a thousand pieces. I’ve just completed a much smaller version of the same pattern and that was bad enough. I also don’t have access to a bag press so something this big in one go isn’t possible for me.

Is the ‘curling’ purely due to tension introduced by drying (shrinking) water based glues and if so would something like an epoxy reduce or eliminate the issue.

You may detect something of a straw clutching exercise here. I’m actually quite keen to do this but also need to make sure anything I produce is stable over the longer term.

 

[Steve Maskery]

It was an epoxy-pressed tabletop that I took to the tip... I then subcontracted it to a local veneer specialist. I lost money on that job.

I'm sorry, but now I have run out of ideas. I would say that this is a very ambitious project, especially without a bag. You can get some pretty big vacuum storage bags now, big enough for duvets and stuff, but I don't think I've ever seen one that big.

Bon courage.
S

 

[HOJ]

I know nothing about making veneered pieces such as this, but I do veneer large panels as in door blanks etc, so in order to do that I have a big 2600mm x 1350mm bag and a vacuum pump, as in this lot: https://www.airpress.co.uk/237-professional-airpress.html

My point is, if it’s a problem for you to achieve your result without one, let me know and we could possibly come to an arrangement for you to borrow my set up.

 

[Accipiter]

@Stuart ... I'm intrigued on what you've been asked to do - you're far braver than I would be for sure! If you go ahead I give you my very best wishes for success. I've absolutely NO experience of doing anything like this at all so can't offer any personal experiences - sorry

I was so intrigued on how to approach such a project I put it into Google AI. First based on your full size and then, as you've mentioned/indicated, working in 300mm areas and Google obliged with some intricate details. Whether another AI programme would suggest different approaches I can't say with only asking Google.

Not everyone cares for what AI apps come up with in their answers so a tad reluctant to copy/paste here... unless you'd like me to? Or you'll put it together an AI app of your choice just to have such describe an approach to consider with what Steve has put forward.

Oh! If of any help... Google first came up eith the backing board bring 18mm to 25mm MDF or Birch faced ply for stability and veneered to the back also to counterbalance the veneered face. Going to be heavy if using something to that size.

 

[Stuart]

It was an epoxy-pressed tabletop that I took to the tip... I then subcontracted it to a local veneer specialist. I lost money on that job.

I'm sorry, but now I have run out of ideas. I would say that this is a very ambitious project, especially without a bag. You can get some pretty big vacuum storage bags now, big enough for duvets and stuff, but I don't think I've ever seen one that big.

Bon courage.
S

Thanks anyhow Steve. That was my last hope so I think this particular project is now dead in the water.

I know nothing about making veneered pieces such as this, but I do veneer large panels as in door blanks etc, so in order to do that I have a big 2600mm x 1350mm bag and a vacuum pump, as in this lot: https://www.airpress.co.uk/237-professional-airpress.html

My point is, if it’s a problem for you to achieve your result without one, let me know and we could possibly come to an arrangement for you to borrow my set up.

That’s incredibly kind of you Paul. I’ve attached a photo of the sort of thing in question and even putting this together at about 325 mm square was ‘fun’ enough to make me feel that anything larger taped before gluing would be an absolute nightmare! Regrettably I think this is now a dead project.

Frank, - thabks for your thoughts but a wider search shows pretty much universal agreement in relation to use of a balance veneer. I’d just hoped that doing it in small areas would men it wouldn’t be necessary.

 

[Accipiter]

No worries Stuart . I'd understood about the backing - to counter the face veneer pieces.

It was just that Google came up with a way to approach the work either as a full work (bagged) or, as you hinted as a possible, the 300mm areas, ways to approach such. I'll not try to give the steps on approach that Google gave .

That's a great piece you've posted above ... no wonder you've been asked for the larger size

 

[HOJ]

Have to say @Stuart that is a brilliant piece of work, I for one would be interested in how its made.

 

[Stuart]

Have to say @Stuart that is a brilliant piece of work, I for one would be interested in how its made.

I can’t claim massive credit as it’s laser cut. The design side is via the software that supports the laser.

I always swore I’d never get a laser as it seemed far too much like hard work for my addled brain. But I realised if I wanted to get some of the ideas out of my head then that was the only way I could do it. Have to say I’m actually enjoying some of the output.

I’m disappointed I can’t take the wall art forward but such is life.