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Diamond plates

Mike G

Mike G

Petrified Pine
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Mike
As diamond plates wear out, do they take on the role of a plate with a higher number?

My 600 grit plate is no longer as efficient as I remember it being iinitially. Can I shuffle it along and use it as a 1000 or 1200 grit plate?
 
I use a fancy Dia-sharp 1200 grit, what I got from Stu-mac (I thought it were finer, but seems I'm wrong)
It will put a mirror finish on the back of a chisel, and compared to a 4000 grit King waterstone,
seems a fair bit finer, as the waterstone will leave a hazy finish.

I also use some cheapie 3 or 4 quid, 400 and 1000 cards from ebay, glued to chunks of fireplace offcuts,
which have a grid pattern, they seem to nick an edge on occasion, even though well broken in.
I wouldn't want to have to use them as a finisher for that reason, though would think that wouldn't be an issue
if they were smooth, as it seems the 1000 grit isn't too far off my waterstone.

Along with the grid pattern, there's monocrystalline and polycrystalline diamonds one could mention,
and whether one gives a better finish than the other, possibly applicable in terms of no stray larger grits
in the mix, as I can't say if the grid pattern is troublesome on fancier versions, (guessing they exist and are proven to work well)

All the best
Tom
 
Mike G said:
As diamond plates wear out, do they take on the role of a plate with a higher number?

My 600 grit plate is no longer as efficient as I remember it being iinitially. Can I shuffle it along and use it as a 1000 or 1200 grit plate?
Click to expand...
I don't know Mike, but I suspect the edges of the particles just get blunt so that they don't cut well rather than cut finer.
 
Worn abrasive, of any nature, does not become a finer grit, it just becomes blunt.
That's why people who rub together two pieces of sandpaper to make it "finer" are idiots. All that happens is that neither piece does its job properly.
Diamond stones are no different in that regard.
S
 
The size of the abrasive particles does not change due to wear. It is just that the sharp edges facing your workpiece break off. The result is that the scratches will still be spaced apart the same as when the abrasive was sharp, but the scratches will mostly be less deep. In other words, you will have to work harder to remove the same amount.
 
www.sharpeningsupplies.com

DMT® and Diamond Stone FAQ

Revitalize your knife's edge with DMT Diamond Stones! Crafted with monocrystalline diamonds, these stones offer unparalleled durability and performance. Choose between the continuous surface of the Dia-Sharp line, perfect for maintaining flatness, or the interrupted surface of the Duo-Sharp...
www.sharpeningsupplies.com www.sharpeningsupplies.com

They do wear out. Quality varies. The guy in the link suggests a 10+ year life depending on usage and claims that cleaning may be effective to get rid of swarf build up clogging the stone.
 
AJB Temple said:
...... cleaning may be effective to get rid of swarf build up clogging the stone.
Click to expand...

I bring mine into the house every so often and give them a scrub under the tap with a scrubbing brush and detergent. It's not cleanliness making mine less effective, but one of them is just worn out. I'll invest......
 
I have a 600 and 1200 in the same Vaunt brand as yours I believe Mike and they show similar signs of wear. They've been well used and were cheap at the time so no complaints. I also have a couple of old DMT plates inherited from a mate years ago and I don't feel they're sharp however I have no idea how much use they had previously.
 
I still use a two sided india oil stone when at work and in my workshop. My current one has been knocking around for about 30 years or more and i don't seem to get the problem with grit becoming dull so I guess that's one advantage of the old oil stones over the more modern diamond ones.

I do have diamond plates and do use them for a quick sharpen when I'm busy but when I want a really good finish I always revert to my oil stone. Just what you get used to I suppose Mike.
 
Getting into dangerous territory but have you tried these?

workshopheaven.com

3M™ Sharpening Film Refill Pack (Basic)

3M™ Sharpening Film Refill Pack (Basic) to top up your Workshop Heaven Basic Scary Sharpening Kit. Friendly service, useful advice, next day delivery option.
workshopheaven.com workshopheaven.com


I bought some maybe six years ago and still haven’t used half of them.
Use a diamond plate (does anyone remember when trend sold a lot very cheap?)
Then go up the grades with the film and final autosol strop.
 
Lons said:
I have a 600 and 1200 in the same Vaunt brand as yours I believe Mike....
Click to expand...

Mine are Ultex.

It looks like they may have gone out of business, which is a pity.
 
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Hi Mike, Ultex were dissolved as a company a while back. The owners are also the owners of Vaunt tools. I would think the Vaunt sharpening plates were very similar to the Ultex. My ultex are single sided, the vaunt ones only have double sided though.
 
fezman said:
Hi Mike, Ultex were dissolved as a company a while back. The owners are also the owners of Vaunt tools. I would think the Vaunt sharpening plates were very similar to the Ultex. My ultex are single sided, the vaunt ones only have double sided though.
Click to expand...
Yes, I saw that, and double sided really doesn't suit me at all. If I have to buy a double sided one and only use one side of it, I will, but that feels wasteful.
 
Mike G said:
Yes, I saw that, and double sided really doesn't suit me at all. If I have to buy a double sided one and only use one side of it, I will, but that feels wasteful.
Click to expand...
Mine are single sided as well and I'd noticed the change to double sided. I suppose you could buy two for side by side use and turn them over when they wear out. Or wait to see if a BOGOF offer ever comes up.
 
Lons said:
Mine are single sided as well and I'd noticed the change to double sided. I suppose you could buy two for side by side use and turn them over when they wear out. Or wait to see if a BOGOF offer ever comes up.
Click to expand...
Waiting for offers, they can sometimes be induced by putting goods in your basket online and leaving them there.
Cheers, Andy
 
toolsntat said:
Waiting for offers, they can sometimes be induced by putting goods in your basket online and leaving them there.
Cheers, Andy
Click to expand...
That's a very good point Andy. I do it regularly on ebay especially. It can work the opposite way though with some companies unless you use a different email and system.
 
Mike G said:
Mine are Ultex.

It looks like they may have gone out of business, which is a pity.
Click to expand...
Same as Vaunt, surely? Both "house brands" of ITS aren't they?

Either way I have one of each brand after someone nicked my Ultex double sider
 
Ovaloe said:
Same as Vaunt, surely? Both "house brands" of ITS aren't they?
Click to expand...

Yes, but I use my plates glued down to a plastic board. I like to retain my grip and posture when free-hand sharpening, which would be distrupted by stopping to flip a plate over. Therefore, I want one-sided plates..............or, I get a 2 sided plate and waste one side.


IMG_7566.jpg
 
Mike just sink the plates into a holder so they can not move when you are using them, allow a finger pull to lift and then flip when needed.


The below gives an example of a shop product but you could just hold the plates in some thin plywood cut-outs.

A Dimond Stone.gif
 
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You're missing the point, Mark. You can see my system. I go from one plate to another without taking my hands off the chisel, or re-orientating my body. Stopping, letting go of my grip, flipping a plate over, wetting it, re-taking my grip........that's a recipe for being a few degrees different, and ending up with Jacob's famous rounded bevel. It's different for plane irons, because I use a honing guide, so I could flip a plate......but I'm not going to have two different set ups, one for planes and one for chisels.

And they are in a holder. They're let into the piece of plastic, as per the photo and my description. The plastic is held down on the worktop. Nothing moves. I simply want a replacement plate to fit into my system. I don't want to be changing the way I sharpen after doing it like this for donkey's years.
 
Aren't yours just glued to the plastic surface Mike? Mine are sunk into recesses in a bit of ply so flat with the ply surface and I lift out to clean in the sink. I always intended to swap the ply for a length of soffit / cover PVC but never got around to it. That would work just as well with double sided plates without ruining anything.
 
They are let in, and held with some silicon. I deliberately left them proud. Yes, I could buy a double-sided plate, and only use one side.....but I'd rather buy a single-sided plate.
 
Mike G said:
You're missing the point, Mark. You can see my system. I go from one plate to another without taking my hands off the chisel, or re-orientating my body. Stopping, letting go of my grip, flipping a plate over, wetting it, re-taking my grip........that's a recipe for being a few degrees different, and ending up with Jacob's famous rounded bevel. It's different for plane irons, because I use a honing guide, so I could flip a plate......but I'm not going to have two different set ups, one for planes and one for chisels.

And they are in a holder. They're let into the piece of plastic, as per the photo and my description. The plastic is held down on the worktop. Nothing moves. I simply want a replacement plate to fit into my system. I don't want to be changing the way I sharpen after doing it like this for donkey's years.
Click to expand...
I can see that you have a method that you like and that's not going to be compromised.

As most of my work is on site I tend to just sharpen my tools on the fly wherever I am working at the time and I tend to carry that haphazard aproach into my workshop, maybe it's time for me to be more organised in the workshop.
 
Mike is in effect using the Cosman sharpening set up. It's very quick and efficient. I might have to copy it as I faff around too much, especially when doing the endless sharpening touch ups required by letter carving.
 
Mike G said:
They are let in, and held with some silicon. I deliberately left them proud. Yes, I could buy a double-sided plate, and only use one side.....but I'd rather buy a single-sided plate.
Click to expand...
Taking the long view, you could also buy two double sided plates, use one side of each, and when they wear out swap them around and flip them over to use the other sides. Treat it as two sides giving twice the lifetime and not as replacing two stones.
 
spb said:
Taking the long view, you could also buy two double sided plates, use one side of each, and when they wear out swap them around and flip them over to use the other sides. Treat it as two sides giving twice the lifetime and not as replacing two stones.
Click to expand...
Indeed. That's my fall-back position if I can't find single-sided plates.
 
I haven't looked on the bay to see if single sided diamond hones, what's bonded to a hefty steel plate
are still being sold or infact made, and whether the same quality as the ITS (which I presume are the same as on the Faithful hones?)
What's the price difference between the current ITS ...(when on half price discount, that you see once or twice a year)
and the ebay and amazon's..


Have we perhaps reached the question regarding the longevity of the double sider's, under such circumstances as Mike G's setup?
 
Mike, I do not know your budget but the DMT stones on CHT's website are single sided.
 
With this setup, aren't you afraid of getting swarf of a different grid on your stones while sharpening? Or are you using your stones with very little fluid? Just curious. But I am probably thinking too much of my Shaptons that I need to keep wet when sharpening.
 
HdV said:
With this setup, aren't you afraid of getting swarf of a different grid on your stones while sharpening? Or are you using your stones with very little fluid? Just curious. But I am probably thinking too much of my Shaptons that I need to keep wet when sharpening.
Click to expand...
Diamond plates are robust, and a bit of swarf from another plate is irrelevant. I wet them for use. I understand that water stones are altogether softer, and need treating with care.
 
I realise that diamond stones will not be damaged by swarf. It was more the scratches of a coarser grid on the steel I was thinking about. Not that I think that a few scratches would be really that troublesome, but still I do try to prevent mixing of grids when sharpening (without being paranoid about it). I do rinse my stones thoroughly after use to prevent this. Coarser grid has a tendency to embed itself in the type of stone I use. I expect that won't happen with diamond stones.
 
Blackswanwood said:
DMT also do an 8” x 3” range Bob. They are quite pricey though.
Click to expand...
Thanks, I didn't know that Robert, just looked at the ones Adrian posted. When I bought mine years ago I remember it cost more than I was comfortable with and these cheap Vaunt plates have been very good so far.
 
mine are DMT 8 x 3, they seem fine after 9 years of quite heavy use, maybe a bit less agressive but they still work, I have a EZElap dual sided one that I think is better.
 
I've got some single sided ones off ebay, they are pretty thin and flexible. I knew that when I bought them and intended to stick to a piece of glass I already had. I'm not a heavy user like Mike and they're lasting fine after a couple of years use. At the other end of the spectrum Workshop heaven have some which look to be Japanese at about £80 a pop!
 
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